SSRIs

Question:

Hello to all, Excuse me jumping right in here but I am desperately looking for some info. I’m having no luck finding a local support/self-help group in my area for depression sufferers. I’m in the Guildford, Surrey (UK) area. can anyone help please? Thanks, Blurbubble

Response:

> Hello to all, > Excuse me jumping right in here but I am desperately looking for some info. > I’m having no luck finding a local support/self-help group in my area for > depression sufferers. I’m in the Guildford, Surrey (UK) area. can anyone > help please? > Thanks, > Blurbubble

Well, –> uk.people.support.depression <– ought to get you one step closer

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – in > Hello to all, > Excuse me jumping right in here but I am desperately looking for some > info. > I’m having no luck finding a local support/self-help group in my area for > depression sufferers. I’m in the Guildford, Surrey (UK) area. can anyone > help please? > Thanks, > Blurbubble > Well, –> uk.people.support.depression <– ought to get you one step closer >

Thank you ) Blurbubble

Response:

> Hi Devil,

How have you been keeping?  I’m still messing around with this Zoloft stuff and wonder if it is doing any good. I will be seeing my doctor in two weeks and I hope he offers me something a little bit more stabilizing.  I feel like a yo-yo on Zoloft…during the day I’m basically "up"  during the evenings/nights I’m a basket case. Am interested, what helps you stabilize your moods? Larry tells me to stay with the Zoloft however he hasn’t a clue about how I feel.  His information is good but perhaps its not for me.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi Devil, > How have you been keeping?  I’m still messing around with this Zoloft stuff and > wonder if it is doing any good. > I will be seeing my doctor in two weeks and I hope he offers me something a > little bit more stabilizing.  I feel like a yo-yo on Zoloft…during the day I’m > basically "up"  during the evenings/nights I’m a basket case. Am interested, > what helps you stabilize your moods? > Larry tells me to stay with the Zoloft however he hasn’t a clue about how I > feel.  His information is good but perhaps its not for me.

Hi Jean, I’m doing ok… not too great, not too bad.  Tired and busy too much of the time.  A little lonely & unloved too. I’ve never tried Zoloft (well, I don’t know what the active ingredient is, so possibly I have done under a different name in the UK).  How long have you been taking it for?  Would splitting your dose into morning/evening help, perhaps?  (Or if you do that already, maybe you should stop!).  That’s how I manage my Celexa/Citalopram… half in the am, half in the evening. The only thing that avoids is falling asleep though… I’m pretty much unipolar all the way, so my mood is pretty stable.  It’s just a question of where stable lies… I try to find the right combination of pills to keep it as high as possible I’d trust Larry’s judgement… he’s got a lot of experience and insight on the matter.  But then I’d trust your own judgement too… it’s a personal balance that’s required. Simon (Sleepy)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Hi Devil, > How have you been keeping?  I’m still messing around with this Zoloft > stuff and > wonder if it is doing any good. > I will be seeing my doctor in two weeks and I hope he offers me something > a > little bit more stabilizing.  I feel like a yo-yo on Zoloft…during the > day I’m > basically "up"  during the evenings/nights I’m a basket case. Am > interested, > what helps you stabilize your moods? > Larry tells me to stay with the Zoloft however he hasn’t a clue about how > I > feel.  His information is good but perhaps its not for me. > Hi Jean, > I’m doing ok… not too great, not too bad.  Tired and busy too much of the > time.  A little lonely & unloved too.

Isn’t it sad that those who love you are so far away?  Never met you, but I know I care about you. > I’ve never tried Zoloft (well, I don’t know what the active ingredient is, > so possibly I have done under a different name in the UK).  How long have > you been taking it for?

seven months. > Would splitting your dose into morning/evening > help, perhaps?

I’m trying this now.  2 pills in the morning and one during the evening. > (Or if you do that already, maybe you should stop!).  That’s > how I manage my Celexa/Citalopram… half in the am, half in the evening. > The only thing that avoids is falling asleep though… I’m pretty much > unipolar all the way, so my mood is pretty stable.  It’s just a question of > where stable lies… I try to find the right combination of pills to keep it > as high as possible  Isn’t it sad we need to rely on pills to keep us > sable?  Three years ago I didn’t need any pills. I was pretty well a happy > camper. > I’d trust Larry’s judgement… he’s got a lot of experience and insight on > the matter.  But then I’d trust your own judgement too… it’s a personal > balance that’s required.

I trust my own judgment too.  Each of us have our own problems.  It’s not right to dump these problems on to someone else who perhaps can’t handle their own problems. Take care…I’ll be thinking of you.  Can’t say praying, as I don’t pray anymore. Jean – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Simon > (Sleepy)

Response:

> Isn’t it sad that those who love you are so far away?  Never met you, but I know > I care about you.

Why thank you  It’s actually easier for me having family & friends 5000 miles away… less stressful. > I’m trying this now.  2 pills in the morning and one during the evening.

Let me know if it helps you. > Take care…I’ll be thinking of you.  Can’t say praying, as I don’t pray > anymore.

Thanks… I prefer being thought of than prayed for!  And you too.

Response:

Question:

If I’ve had hypomanic and mixed episodes before should i take Zoloft? will it make me (hypo)manic? the Zoloft is for anexiety (i am in an anexiety study). ~Psychic Venom

Response:

No…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >If I’ve had hypomanic and mixed episodes before should i take Zoloft? will >it make me (hypo)manic? the Zoloft is for anexiety (i am in an anexiety >study). >~Psychic Venom

Response:

Yes it could.  SSRIs have the potential for mania.  They should be used with caution. * Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping.  Smart is Beautiful

Response:

;<Yes it could.  SSRIs have the potential for mania.  They ;<should be used with caution. ;< ;< ;<* Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping. Smart is Beautiful I would agree with that. This if from a personal experience.

Response:

Be very careful with all the serotonin drugs.  I became hypomanic on Luvox and then again on Celexa. Louise – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> No…. >If I’ve had hypomanic and mixed episodes before should i take Zoloft? will >it make me (hypo)manic? the Zoloft is for anexiety (i am in an anexiety >study). >~Psychic Venom

Response:

>Im off to go find alt~support~I-have-a-pimple-on-my-nose-and-a-blind- >date-tommorrow. >LOL

I thought those kind of things only happened to me, good luck with your date. Web Page at: www.robertpo.com For email replies remove the ****

Response:

Question:

Yeah, i’ve been following this with interest …    :-) i’ve been taking prozac for 6 yrs now    < Gronk !!! > M.S. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >x-no-archive: yes > Web Page at: http://www.robertpo.com >Prozac is losing its patent protection, and it is starting to drum up >support for the New! Improved! Gets Clothes Whiter! Prozac by casting >aspersions on the original formulation.

Response:

>Yes I saw it Robert, and…..you can chat live with the >author  of "Prozac Backlash" at abc20/20 website after > the show, but, Im not sure of the exact url, sorry. >I almost posted this too.

I had those very same symptoms that the subjects described, the suicidal ideation the thoughts of cutting, God it’s horrible to consider that it was a damn side effect. My pdoc thought I was prone to suggestions too, hope she watched that! Web Page at:www.robertpo.com

Response:

Good post, Mark. But you really should give credit to McMan’s Newsletter wherefrom the material was derived (plagiarized???). — Deep – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> x-no-archive: yes > > Web Page at: http://www.robertpo.com > Prozac is losing its patent protection, and it is starting to drum up > support for the New! Improved! Gets Clothes Whiter! Prozac by casting > aspersions on the original formulation > Nihil, >   Here are the facts behind tonight’s show. > Mark > PROZAC MANIA – PART II > Paradox:  If you do the right thing and make your current product safer, > does this amount to an express admission that your original product was > found wanting?  Could you be held liable?  Could your behavior even be > construed as fraudulent? > This is the problem Eli Lilly, makers of Prozac (fluoxetine), may be facing. > The company is preparing to launch a new version of its blockbuster > antidepressant next year, under a license agreement with Boston-area > Sepracor, just as its 14-year patent is due to expire.  The original Prozac, > according to Eli Lilly, carries a number of risks.  In the words of the > manufacturer: > "Fluoxetine produces a state of inner restlessness (akathisia), which is one > of its more significant side effects … It is also known that in some > patients, use of fluoxetine is associated with severe anxiety leading to > intense violent suicidal thoughts and self mutilation …. In other patients > manic behavior follows treatment with fluoxetine." > All this is spelled out in Eli Lilly’s patent for its new version of the > drug.  According to the patent, the new Prozac will eliminate the side > effects of the old drug.  The drug maker filed for the patent in 1995 and it > was granted in January 1998.  For whatever reasons, Eli Lilly did not > broadcast the news. > A year later, the company was taken to court by a family who refused to > settle (see Newsletter2#18).  Bill Forsyth, a retiree living in Hawaii, had > been prescribed Prozac for his anxiety and depression, and was admitted to a > psychiatric hospital, where doctors continued giving him the drug.  Eleven > days later, he returned home and stabbed his wife of 37 years, then impaled > himself on a kitchen knife. > Despite the disclosure in court of documents showing that Eli Lilly had been > fully aware of Prozac’s side effects since the 1970s and 1980s and had been > active in the suppression of certain information, the jury decided that the > drug was not responsible for Bill Forsyth’s acts of violence.  Then again, > the jury knew nothing about Eli Lilly’s new patent.  According to the > Forsyth’s lawyer, Eli Lilly never revealed its license agreement to the > plaintiffs or the court.  So last week the Forsyths filed a federal lawsuit > accusing the drug maker of fraud. > Dr David Healy of the North Wales Department of Psychological Medicine at > the University of Wales, who testified as an expert witness at the Forsyth > trial, estimates that "probably 50,000 people have committed suicide on > Prozac since its launch, over and above the number who would have done so if > left untreated." > But an Eli Lilly spokesman maintains:  "There is no credible evidence that > establishes a causal link between Prozac and violent or suicidal behavior. > There is, to the contrary, scientific evidence showing that Prozac and > medicines like it actually protect against such behaviors." > No doubt, the company will have ample opportunity to defend that claim in > court. > For two media articles, please see:

http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat=">clic > k here</a> > <a

href="http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat= – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> .

Response:

I am very very very very sorry.  I slam stuff together and cut off the edges for neatness. Im not trying to imply that my team of scientists and reporters compiled all that. If I was, I would be bragging for weeks. It wasnt plagiarism in my mind, cause I wasnt trying to pass it off as new and origional work and deliberately not giving the author credit. I rushed and left some stuff on the bottom, but cut it off too early. Sorry. I guess I should be sure to give reference sources in the future. I will drink a glass of mustard and puke on my new shoes tonight for punishment. Anyone interested in subscribing to this fine newsletter which contains a variety of interesting bipolar related issues can do so by following the link below. It is called "McMann’s depression and bipolar weekly." The author is John McManamy. He does this solely for the purpose of helping others and it is free. It seems very up to date. And, I heard he is very handsome and a sharp dresser and can really dance. If you are not a subscriber, please sign up here: <http://www.suite101.com/splash.cfm/depression> <a href="http://www.suite101.com/splash.cfm/depression">click here</a>

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Good post, Mark. But you really should give credit to McMan’s Newsletter > wherefrom the material was derived (plagiarized???). > — > Deep > > x-no-archive: yes > > > Web Page at: http://www.robertpo.com > > Prozac is losing its patent protection, and it is starting to drum up > > support for the New! Improved! Gets Clothes Whiter! Prozac by casting > > aspersions on the original formulation > Nihil, >   Here are the facts behind tonight’s show. > Mark > PROZAC MANIA – PART II > Paradox:  If you do the right thing and make your current product safer, > does this amount to an express admission that your original product was > found wanting?  Could you be held liable?  Could your behavior even be > construed as fraudulent? > This is the problem Eli Lilly, makers of Prozac (fluoxetine), may be > facing. > The company is preparing to launch a new version of its blockbuster > antidepressant next year, under a license agreement with Boston-area > Sepracor, just as its 14-year patent is due to expire.  The original > Prozac, > according to Eli Lilly, carries a number of risks.  In the words of the > manufacturer: > "Fluoxetine produces a state of inner restlessness (akathisia), which is > one > of its more significant side effects … It is also known that in some > patients, use of fluoxetine is associated with severe anxiety leading to > intense violent suicidal thoughts and self mutilation …. In other > patients > manic behavior follows treatment with fluoxetine." > All this is spelled out in Eli Lilly’s patent for its new version of the > drug.  According to the patent, the new Prozac will eliminate the side > effects of the old drug.  The drug maker filed for the patent in 1995 and > it > was granted in January 1998.  For whatever reasons, Eli Lilly did not > broadcast the news. > A year later, the company was taken to court by a family who refused to > settle (see Newsletter2#18).  Bill Forsyth, a retiree living in Hawaii, > had > been prescribed Prozac for his anxiety and depression, and was admitted to > a > psychiatric hospital, where doctors continued giving him the drug. Eleven > days later, he returned home and stabbed his wife of 37 years, then > impaled > himself on a kitchen knife. > Despite the disclosure in court of documents showing that Eli Lilly had > been > fully aware of Prozac’s side effects since the 1970s and 1980s and had > been > active in the suppression of certain information, the jury decided that > the > drug was not responsible for Bill Forsyth’s acts of violence.  Then again, > the jury knew nothing about Eli Lilly’s new patent.  According to the > Forsyth’s lawyer, Eli Lilly never revealed its license agreement to the > plaintiffs or the court.  So last week the Forsyths filed a federal > lawsuit > accusing the drug maker of fraud. > Dr David Healy of the North Wales Department of Psychological Medicine at > the University of Wales, who testified as an expert witness at the Forsyth > trial, estimates that "probably 50,000 people have committed suicide on > Prozac since its launch, over and above the number who would have done so > if > left untreated." > But an Eli Lilly spokesman maintains:  "There is no credible evidence that > establishes a causal link between Prozac and violent or suicidal behavior. > There is, to the contrary, scientific evidence showing that Prozac and > medicines like it actually protect against such behaviors." > No doubt, the company will have ample opportunity to defend that claim in > court. > For two media articles, please see:

http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat=">clic > k here</a> > <a

href="http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat= – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> .

Response:

Here’s the exact text from McMan’s Newsletter. — Deep > –This is the message header– > McMAN’S DEPRESSION AND BIPOLAR WEEKLY (June 14, 2000 Vol 2 No 21) > PROZAC MANIA – PART II > Paradox:  If you do the right thing and make your current product safer,

does this amount to an express admission that your original product was found wanting?  Could you be held liable?  Could your behavior even be construed as fraudulent? > This is the problem Eli Lilly, makers of Prozac (fluoxetine), may be

facing.  The company is preparing to launch a new version of its blockbuster antidepressant next year, under a license agreement with Boston-area Sepracor, just as its 14-year patent is due to expire.  The original Prozac, according to Eli Lilly, carries a number of risks.  In the words of the manufacturer: > "Fluoxetine produces a state of inner restlessness (akathisia), which is

one of its more significant side effects … It is also known that in some patients, use of fluoxetine is associated with severe anxiety leading to intense violent suicidal thoughts and self mutilation …. In other patients manic behavior follows treatment with fluoxetine." > All this is spelled out in Eli Lilly’s patent for its new version of the

drug.  According to the patent, the new Prozac will eliminate the side effects of the old drug.  The drug maker filed for the patent in 1995 and it was granted in January 1998.  For whatever reasons, Eli Lilly did not broadcast the news. > A year later, the company was taken to court by a family who refused to

settle (see Newsletter2#18).  Bill Forsyth, a retiree living in Hawaii, had been prescribed Prozac for his anxiety and depression, and was admitted to a psychiatric hospital, where doctors continued giving him the drug.  Eleven days later, he returned home and stabbed his wife of 37 years, then impaled himself on a kitchen knife. > Despite the disclosure in court of documents showing that Eli Lilly had

been  fully aware of Prozac’s side effects since the 1970s and 1980s and had been active in the suppression of certain information, the jury decided that the drug was not responsible for Bill Forsyth’s acts of violence.  Then again, the jury knew nothing about Eli Lilly’s new patent.  According to the Forsyth’s lawyer, Eli Lilly never revealed its license agreement to the plaintiffs or the court.  So last week the Forsyths filed a federal lawsuit accusing the drug maker of fraud. > Dr David Healy of the North Wales Department of Psychological Medicine at

the University of Wales, who testified as an expert witness at the Forsyth trial, estimates that "probably 50,000 people have committed suicide on Prozac since its launch, over and above the number who would have done so if left untreated." > But an Eli Lilly spokesman maintains:  "There is no credible evidence that

establishes a causal link between Prozac and violent or suicidal behavior. There is, to the contrary, scientific evidence showing that Prozac and medicines like it actually protect against such behaviors." > No doubt, the company will have ample opportunity to defend that claim in court. > For two media articles, please see:

http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat=">clic k here</a> > <a

href="http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat= > http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=061100&ID=s813751&cat= > <a

href="http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=061100&ID=s813751&cat= ">click here</a> > For Eli Lilly’s new patent, go to: > http://164.195.100.11/netahtml/srchnum.htm > <a href="http://164.195.100.11/netahtml/srchnum.htm">click here</a> > .. and enter "5,708,035" in the search field..

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> x-no-archive: yes > Good post, Mark. But you really should give credit to McMan’s Newsletter > wherefrom the material was derived (plagiarized???). > — > Deep > That is categorically NOT where_I_read the article. I believe that I > read the article while doing a search with > http://www.themedengine.com > …

Response:

You’re forgiven, if, for no other reason the literary beauty of your reply ) As to the low down on Prozac……. YES. This is exactly the point I have been trying to  make for some time now in the face of what I perceived as defensiveness or even ridicule. — Deep – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The interesting thing is that for some people, Prozac is a very > effective medicine with no side effects. But as the program > and research has show, it can be devastating, leading to suicide > in quite a few instances, as well as tardive dyskinesia…destroying >  control of the motor nerves. There are instances of homicidal > violence, and it appears that Eli Lilly knew of this and covered > it up. > mark > x-no-archive: yes > > Good post, Mark. But you really should give credit to McMan’s Newsletter > > wherefrom the material was derived (plagiarized???). > > — > > Deep > That is categorically NOT where_I_read the article. I believe that I > read the article while doing a search with > http://www.themedengine.com > …

Response:

The interesting thing is that for some people, Prozac is a very effective medicine with no side effects. But as the program and research has show, it can be devastating, leading to suicide in quite a few instances, as well as tardive dyskinesia…destroying  control of the motor nerves. There are instances of homicidal violence, and it appears that Eli Lilly knew of this and covered it up. mark

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> x-no-archive: yes > Good post, Mark. But you really should give credit to McMan’s Newsletter > wherefrom the material was derived (plagiarized???). > — > Deep > That is categorically NOT where_I_read the article. I believe that I > read the article while doing a search with > http://www.themedengine.com > …

Response:

Web Page at: http://www.robertpo.com

Response:

> Web Page at: http://www.robertpo.com

Yes I saw it Robert, and…..you can chat live with the author  of "Prozac Backlash" at abc20/20 website after  the show, but, Im not sure of the exact url, sorry. I almost posted this too.

Response:

> x-no-archive: yes > Web Page at: http://www.robertpo.com > Prozac is losing its patent protection, and it is starting to drum up > support for the New! Improved! Gets Clothes Whiter! Prozac by casting > aspersions on the original formulation

Nihil,   Here are the facts behind tonight’s show. Mark PROZAC MANIA – PART II Paradox:  If you do the right thing and make your current product safer, does this amount to an express admission that your original product was found wanting?  Could you be held liable?  Could your behavior even be construed as fraudulent? This is the problem Eli Lilly, makers of Prozac (fluoxetine), may be facing. The company is preparing to launch a new version of its blockbuster antidepressant next year, under a license agreement with Boston-area Sepracor, just as its 14-year patent is due to expire.  The original Prozac, according to Eli Lilly, carries a number of risks.  In the words of the manufacturer: "Fluoxetine produces a state of inner restlessness (akathisia), which is one of its more significant side effects … It is also known that in some patients, use of fluoxetine is associated with severe anxiety leading to intense violent suicidal thoughts and self mutilation …. In other patients manic behavior follows treatment with fluoxetine." All this is spelled out in Eli Lilly’s patent for its new version of the drug.  According to the patent, the new Prozac will eliminate the side effects of the old drug.  The drug maker filed for the patent in 1995 and it was granted in January 1998.  For whatever reasons, Eli Lilly did not broadcast the news. A year later, the company was taken to court by a family who refused to settle (see Newsletter2#18).  Bill Forsyth, a retiree living in Hawaii, had been prescribed Prozac for his anxiety and depression, and was admitted to a psychiatric hospital, where doctors continued giving him the drug.  Eleven days later, he returned home and stabbed his wife of 37 years, then impaled himself on a kitchen knife. Despite the disclosure in court of documents showing that Eli Lilly had been fully aware of Prozac’s side effects since the 1970s and 1980s and had been active in the suppression of certain information, the jury decided that the drug was not responsible for Bill Forsyth’s acts of violence.  Then again, the jury knew nothing about Eli Lilly’s new patent.  According to the Forsyth’s lawyer, Eli Lilly never revealed its license agreement to the plaintiffs or the court.  So last week the Forsyths filed a federal lawsuit accusing the drug maker of fraud. Dr David Healy of the North Wales Department of Psychological Medicine at the University of Wales, who testified as an expert witness at the Forsyth trial, estimates that "probably 50,000 people have committed suicide on Prozac since its launch, over and above the number who would have done so if left untreated." But an Eli Lilly spokesman maintains:  "There is no credible evidence that establishes a causal link between Prozac and violent or suicidal behavior. There is, to the contrary, scientific evidence showing that Prozac and medicines like it actually protect against such behaviors." No doubt, the company will have ample opportunity to defend that claim in court. For two media articles, please see: http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat=">clic k here</a> <a href="http://www.spokane.net/news-story-body.asp?Date=060900&ID=s813090&cat= .

Response:

Question:

I recommend you don’t do it. The "PM" in Excedrin PM is diphenhydramine, aka "Benadryl", the antihistamine. SSRIs should, in general, not be mixed with diphenhydramine without doctor approval. BTW: diphenhydramine is also the active ingredient in "Nitol" and "Sominex". In my experience, just taking 200 mg of ibuprofen (Advil) will often put me to sleep if I have a headache and need it. You shouldn’t take these things *just* to sleep. If you need sleep help, you should take Ambien (Zolpidem). It is safe, and in low doses (2.5 – 7.5 mg), not addictive. DO NOT COMBINE WITH ALCOHOL!. This does require a prescription, though. (high doses, i.e. > 10 mg, can create addiction and abuse) Oh, and BTW, if you are on any of the psychotropic medications, avoid melantonin also. It will really screw up your brain worse than it already is. Ted > hi, there > anyone have information/experiences about taking Zoloft and, oh say, > Excedrin PM? > thanks! > shawn

– email: zzyzx69 <at> usa <dot> net Before you buy.

Response:

hi, there anyone have information/experiences about taking Zoloft and, oh say, Excedrin PM? thanks! shawn

Response:

Question:

How interesting. This "person" has posted exactly 9 times, starting yesterday (4/23) in the following groups: misc.health.alternative own.health.herbs .health.herbs alt.quit.smoking.support sci.med.diseases.cancer alt.support.stop-smoking "Deanne" is really on the ball, yes? Compare the writing style below with the writing style of "Ornery". Lynda, does Bigfoot.com allow more than one email address per account? Author: Andrew Strempler (Bsc Pharm)   << previous  

Question:

: : : : California is <really> out there?  this all gets rather abstract at times ….. :   or was it acute, yes acute, acute brit named anne. ttfn : : : : : — : Anne Marshall : : : :

Response:

. . . Never   again to   speak            freely to   speak     at       all Never   again     to       speak to him  . . . Safe at last . . . — Anne Marshall          

Response:

Anne (with the perfect name): I haven’t the slightest idea what your post means, the significance is yours alone to embrace, I do feel it is important to you that you sent it across the Atlantic to land here in California, and many other places.  Whats up Anne with the perfect name, I bet Mr. Marshall was blessed with less than a perfect name, but nevermind he was rewarded with Anne, I have fallen in love with a name, is this in the DSMlV I wonder? ;-o) Regards, Vern

Response:

> Anne (with the perfect name): > I haven’t the slightest idea what your post means, the significance > is yours alone to embrace, I do feel it is important to you that > you sent it across the Atlantic to land here in California, and many > other places.  Whats up Anne with the perfect name, I bet Mr. > Marshall was blessed with less than a perfect name, but nevermind > he was rewarded with Anne, I have fallen in love with a name, is > this in the DSMlV I wonder? ;-o) > Regards, > Vern

Pobody’s nerfect, as they say Vern ….. Toying with verse at the wrong time of day, tired of having my head bitten off for saying the wrong thing at the wrong time (? to the wrong person) …. figuring if I say nothing then there will be <no> cause for the anger (that I can’t cope with) –  just feel like I should disappear. I don’t think this has <anything> to do with <any> diagnosis….. wierd.       He is on meds that he forgets to take and I need to be nursey to "remind" him to take (the paroxetine) …. if I <don’t> nurse him I get the payback . <I> am on no meds and haven’t been since xmas ….  surviving …… but sometimes it seems only just …. California is <really> out there?  this all gets rather abstract at times ….. — Anne Marshall      

Response:

Question:

Welcome Rachael At the risk of being considered pedantic, most of you points are requests rather the questions <g> Having said that,  …  I’ll give ‘em a go. 1)  a good start for rapid cycling (or ultra rapid cycling) is to search the www.dejanews.com in the alt.support.depression.manic (ASDM) and soc.support.depression.manic (SSDM) for those key words and you will get quite a few descriptions and comments from people over the last few years.   Childhood on set is also discussed.  Well worth looking through the archives to see what has gone before. Another great site to start with is http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.bipolar.html  this will answer a lot of questions. 2)  well, I think you’ve coined a new phrase never before used here. " (the depression continually gets worse and reaches its  peak)" thank you for this – I love it    as for the relationship between BP and hormones well, there’s lots of stuff there for the looking here’s one – http://www.onhealth.com/ch1/columnist/item,46699.asp but if you do a search with the keywords bipolar and hormones you will find lots. Currently I’m using http://www.redesearch.com/ as a search engine – it seems to be a very good mega-search anyone for anyone interested in these things and it found heaps of hits – it’s just a matter of refining it to what you want. 3)  Dunno – but then, I am in Australia so I suppose I am not the best around to know. and you last bit —  I could not agree more.  18 months ago I came here looking for information about manic depression as my wife had just been diagnosed and we didnt know how it affected people in the real world rather then the clinical book world.  To be told that something that is happening to you is rare or uncommon, or that the symptom you are describing isn’t one they have heard of is disheartening – but then you come here and read someone posting EXACTLY the same thing from the other side of the world.  The heart un-dis’s itself a little and you then look a little more into it, ask people questions (no matter how silly – I sometimes corner the market on silly questions) and then go back to the doctor much more informed then before – allowing you to ask the questions you want answers to rather then vague questions that the doctor doesnt understand.   So, now after 18 months I’ve decided for all its arguements and stuff this is a place that is great for people who want to understand something as complicated as bi-polar.  It’s also a nice place to meet nice people (well some are nice some of the time …) but it’s really important to remember a lot of people who post here are bi-polar so there might be some variety in thier views and attitudes.  It comes with the territory.  The only advice I can give is try not to burn your bridges if you are upset by something or someone.  There are a lot of nice people, many who just send e-mails as they’ve been hurt by things in the past and don’t want to bob up too high in public and there will always be help in some form or another. Tony ynoT from the land of vegemite and lamingtons oh and platypuses – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Hi >My name is Rachael I am 17 and I have been reading this newsgroup for a >while. For the last couple of months I have been being assessed by a pdoc >who has suggested that I show the signs of childhood onset bipolar disorder >combined with an anxiety disorder. I am coming off the antidepressant, >Citalopram, that I was previously taking and I am starting on Carbamazapine >(Tegretol). I have had a fairly colorful medical history including a brain >tumor of the pituitary gland which was removed just over a year ago. >I have a couple of questions which I would be really grateful if anyone >could answer: >1) I am interested in ANY articles on childhood onset or rapid cycling >bipolar disorder >2) My bipolar takes the form of 2 weeks of mania or hypomania followed by 2 >weeks of depression (the depression continually gets worse and reaches its >peak just before the mania starts). I don’t seem to have any ‘normal’ time. >The mood swings tie in with my cycle as the depression always ends 5 days >after my period had started. I know that the mood swings are not just a form >of bad PMT as I suffered from the same severe mood swings before my periods >started. I have also tried the Contraceptive pill which seemed to have no >effect and even possibly made things worse. My pituitary tumor also >manifested itself by raising my levels of the hormone prolactin and at the >moment all my hormone levels are borderline normal. Because of all of this I >feel that there may be some connection between my bipolar and hormones. If >anyone knows of anything about connections between bipolar and hormones I >would be VERY interested. >3) I live in the UK and I would be very interested if anyone knows of any >places that specialize in bipolar in the UK or any hospitals that are >particularly experienced in treating it. >Finally I just wanted to say thank you to anyone who has recently posted on >this newsgroup. When I was diagnosed with bipolar the first thing I did was >to I read all the criteria, I felt unbelievably relieved as everything >seemed to fit and I finally knew what was wrong. When the reality of the >diagnosis hit me I suddenly felt very isolated as what I had was just >something in common with the diagnostic criteria – a piece of paper. >Discovering this newsgroup has made me realize that I have something in >common with more than just a piece of paper. So many of you out there open >yourselves up to the world so when people like me get diagnosed for the >first time we don’t feel alone, but realize that there is a whole community >out there just waiting to support us. I really respect that. Thank you. >I hope you don’t mind if I continue to post on this newsgroup, >Rach

Response:

Hi Rachael, Welcome to ASDM. > My name is Rachael I am 17 and I have been reading this newsgroup for a > while. For the last couple of months I have been being assessed by a pdoc > who has suggested that I show the signs of childhood onset bipolar disorder > combined with an anxiety disorder. I am coming off the antidepressant, > Citalopram, that I was previously taking and I am starting on Carbamazapine > (Tegretol). I have had a fairly colorful medical history including a brain > tumor of the pituitary gland which was removed just over a year ago. > I have a couple of questions which I would be really grateful if anyone > could answer: > 1) I am interested in ANY articles on childhood onset or rapid cycling > bipolar disorder

http://www.nami.org/helpline/bipolar-child.html > 2) My bipolar takes the form of 2 weeks of mania or hypomania followed by 2 > weeks of depression (the depression continually gets worse and reaches its > peak just before the mania starts). I don’t seem to have any ‘normal’ time. > The mood swings tie in with my cycle as the depression always ends 5 days > after my period had started. I know that the mood swings are not just a form > of bad PMT as I suffered from the same severe mood swings before my periods > started. I have also tried the Contraceptive pill which seemed to have no > effect and even possibly made things worse. My pituitary tumor also > manifested itself by raising my levels of the hormone prolactin and at the > moment all my hormone levels are borderline normal. Because of all of this I > feel that there may be some connection between my bipolar and hormones. If > anyone knows of anything about connections between bipolar and hormones I > would be VERY interested.

A medline search would help. Or you can use any of the following search engines: Try this site  http://www.highway61.com   and type in drug in question. Also try: http://www.dogpile.com/ http://www.beaucoup.com/ You can also use an Alta Vista search. Another medical site is http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/PubMed/ Health & Medical Search Engines http://www.healthcareforums.com/sengines_frame.html Contains: Internets – search 1000 databases MedHunt by HON CiteLine by Citizen 1 Open Directory Project by NewHoo (just purchased by Netscape) Bookmark this great new resource.  http://www.isleuth.com/usen.html is a site that allows you to type in specific things, like a particular drug, and get a large list of references both at drug web sites and from dejanews listings of newsgroup discussions.  This information courtesy of runner1, one of of our resident researchers. Then there is the following list compiled by James Milton: Health & Medical Search Engines http://www.healthcareforums.com/sengines_frame.html Contains: Internets – search 1000 databases MedHunt by HON CiteLine by Citizen 1 Open Directory Project by NewHoo (just purchased by Netscape) > 3) I live in the UK and I would be very interested if anyone knows of any > places that specialize in bipolar in the UK or any hospitals that are > particularly experienced in treating it.

I live in the US so I cannot be of any help here. > Finally I just wanted to say thank you to anyone who has recently posted on > this newsgroup. When I was diagnosed with bipolar the first thing I did was > to I read all the criteria, I felt unbelievably relieved as everything > seemed to fit and I finally knew what was wrong. When the reality of the > diagnosis hit me I suddenly felt very isolated as what I had was just > something in common with the diagnostic criteria – a piece of paper. > Discovering this newsgroup has made me realize that I have something in > common with more than just a piece of paper. So many of you out there open > yourselves up to the world so when people like me get diagnosed for the > first time we don’t feel alone, but realize that there is a whole community > out there just waiting to support us. I really respect that. Thank you. > I hope you don’t mind if I continue to post on this newsgroup,

We are happy to have you here :0) Peace, — Lynda

Response:

Hi My name is Rachael I am 17 and I have been reading this newsgroup for a while. For the last couple of months I have been being assessed by a pdoc who has suggested that I show the signs of childhood onset bipolar disorder combined with an anxiety disorder. I am coming off the antidepressant, Citalopram, that I was previously taking and I am starting on Carbamazapine (Tegretol). I have had a fairly colorful medical history including a brain tumor of the pituitary gland which was removed just over a year ago. I have a couple of questions which I would be really grateful if anyone could answer: 1) I am interested in ANY articles on childhood onset or rapid cycling bipolar disorder 2) My bipolar takes the form of 2 weeks of mania or hypomania followed by 2 weeks of depression (the depression continually gets worse and reaches its peak just before the mania starts). I don’t seem to have any ‘normal’ time. The mood swings tie in with my cycle as the depression always ends 5 days after my period had started. I know that the mood swings are not just a form of bad PMT as I suffered from the same severe mood swings before my periods started. I have also tried the Contraceptive pill which seemed to have no effect and even possibly made things worse. My pituitary tumor also manifested itself by raising my levels of the hormone prolactin and at the moment all my hormone levels are borderline normal. Because of all of this I feel that there may be some connection between my bipolar and hormones. If anyone knows of anything about connections between bipolar and hormones I would be VERY interested. 3) I live in the UK and I would be very interested if anyone knows of any places that specialize in bipolar in the UK or any hospitals that are particularly experienced in treating it. Finally I just wanted to say thank you to anyone who has recently posted on this newsgroup. When I was diagnosed with bipolar the first thing I did was to I read all the criteria, I felt unbelievably relieved as everything seemed to fit and I finally knew what was wrong. When the reality of the diagnosis hit me I suddenly felt very isolated as what I had was just something in common with the diagnostic criteria – a piece of paper. Discovering this newsgroup has made me realize that I have something in common with more than just a piece of paper. So many of you out there open yourselves up to the world so when people like me get diagnosed for the first time we don’t feel alone, but realize that there is a whole community out there just waiting to support us. I really respect that. Thank you. I hope you don’t mind if I continue to post on this newsgroup, Rach

Response:

Question:

Kerri I’m not bi-polar my wife is.  (yes it’s true all you others!!! )  I’ve managed to hang around here for over a year initially to learn what I could about how to cope with our situation and later because there are a lot of nice people here and … well frankly .. I think of a lot of people here as good friends now.     The first step is to get a diagnosis.   After that it is important to both be convinced about the diagnosis.  If you find some things on the newsgroup that remind you of your husband print them out and read them to him at some time he is ready to listen.  From my experience that is not always <g>   As for your questions I’ll try to answer them below – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I am new here, and have spent many weeks educating my self on MD from >all your comments. I really appreciate everything you all go through. >I have been an observer of my husbands illness for 13 years.  We have >had so many terrible money problems and behavior issues. I have >finally been able to understand them from the comments I’ve read in >this group and on other web sites.   >I need some advice on how to help my husband.  He has finally accepted >that he has a problem. Almost everyone in his family is on some sort of >anti-depressent and his father committed suicide.  His Family Doc put >him on Zoloft and it made a huge difference in how he handled problems, >but didn’t help the manic episodes and had some not so nice side >affects.  Now I am trying to get him to go to a Psychiatrist and he is >balking.  I told him he needs to have his meds evaluated.   >Here’s my questions: >1.  I’ve made an appt at a University med center (A good hospital). >    He is supposed to meet with a resident then overseen by a PD.   >    Is this wise?  Should we go with a more experienced PD?   >    I want this to be a positive experience for him.

Take it when you’ve got it.   No matter what a doctor may or may not be good.   Who  knows, this resident may become a world authority. Just make sure that before you go work out details of what has happened in the last 13 years >2.  If he doesn’t show up for his appt (like he did today), should I >    go and talk to the PD initially?  Is that appropriate?

It’s probably not much value really – explain to him that going will help both of you deal with the problems >3.  Are there any other spouses out there that have been down this >    road and can share their experience?

Yes.  E-mail me.  Others have heard the storys and are bored with it >My husband is a sweet, kind, generous man and I  am so lucky to have >him in my life.  His MD has made his personality what it is, but I hate >to seem him suffer… and the kids and I as a result. We have had such >serious money problems (still do) and he is always gone (trying to fix >the money problems he created).  He goes for days without sleep to the >point he stumbles around and is confused.  He recently ended his >business in order to be home with us more, but now he is very depressed >and doesn’t know what his role is.  I can support our family so I asked >him to take some time off and get healthy.  It’s not working too well. >He feels I am trying to control him too much (I am in a sense, as I’m >trying to set boundries to keep us on a budget).  He needs me to be his >consciense, but I can’t figure out how to do that without being a nag >(which isn’t my nature). I guess I just need to be more patient.

Basically you are damned if you do, damned if you dont.  Remember you have to have a life too. >Thanks for any advice you can share.  I tried to keep this short (sorry)

Tony ynoT

Response:

I’ve tried but I can’t ignore this advice. Praying is admirable but unfortunately for a lot of people it does nothing.  You are as much entitled to your opinion as everyone else here but to post that the first thing you do is go to a church – really!    and to say "generally the problem gets worse" by taking drugs.    You are treading on very dangerous grounds in that comment. Would you might providing the proof in what you say.   It is my experience that medication actually works for a wide variety of people – the general task is to find the "right" medication – after some stability is reached cognative therapy etc. tends to work better as well.   Have you ever tried to reason with a manic person steve? Ever had to nurse a depressed person who wants to die any way they can?  Perhaps you think talking to them will cure it all without any other assistance – what happens  after you cure manic depression?  you going to cure the cancer patients, diabetics – people missing limbs?   If you are going to answer people give an objective view – it helps everyone. Tony ynoT – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Are you active socially? >Have friends noticed a abrupt shift in your husband? Or was it a gradual >thing that took its toll? > I would suggest first going to some spiritual guidance.. I expect that that >has been out of your life.. even if most churches today aren’t what they are >supposed to be. > Alternately, I would suggest a cognitive behavior therapist who might help >him handle the turmoil he is perceiving in his life..  frustration can cause >serious problems such as you state your husband is having. Preists are >cheaper… and they won’t turn you away if they have any common decency. You >need not go there for anything other than help. >My opinion is that the last thing you want to do is to begin taking drugs to >"fix" his problem… generally the problem only becomes worse. Sometimes, >much worse. >Thanks for any advice you can share.  I tried to keep this short (sorry)

Response:

Are you active socially? Have friends noticed a abrupt shift in your husband? Or was it a gradual thing that took its toll?  I would suggest first going to some spiritual guidance.. I expect that that has been out of your life.. even if most churches today aren’t what they are supposed to be.  Alternately, I would suggest a cognitive behavior therapist who might help him handle the turmoil he is perceiving in his life..  frustration can cause serious problems such as you state your husband is having. Preists are cheaper… and they won’t turn you away if they have any common decency. You need not go there for anything other than help. My opinion is that the last thing you want to do is to begin taking drugs to "fix" his problem… generally the problem only becomes worse. Sometimes, much worse. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Thanks for any advice you can share.  I tried to keep this short (sorry)

Response:

I’m in the same boat as you. The only thing I can suggest is making sure you’re both seeing how his problems (money, personality, etc.) are affecting you, and how he would like you to respond.  You must also find out how he’s viewing the situation _before_ MD is considered.  (In other words, what of what he does/decisions he makes comes from the MD or from him?)  If that can be established as a reference point, you can start to try and smooth over the rough edges brought about by MD. I’d encourage you to make getting him better meds a HIGH priority.  Until he can work toward becoming more stable, there’s very little you can do for him, and very little you can expect him to do (like, "Be reliable.").  My best friend is MD, and I’ve learned that, when he’s going through a phase, there’s nothing I can do to help him other than work with him through the phase.  To expect him to rationally analyze how we relate and how MD affects our relationship is impossible.  AFTER and only after the phase has passed can we discuss it, learn from it, and work on a way to avoid it from recurring. I’ve been looking to chat with other BPSOs here.  Feel free to e-mail me anytime.  There’s more where the stuff above came from, but a) it’s 1:25am, b) I have to be at work at 9:00am, and c) my contacts are drying out. <sigh> <grin>

[snip] – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I need some advice on how to help my husband.  He has finally accepted > that he has a problem. Almost everyone in his family is on some sort of > anti-depressent and his father committed suicide.  His Family Doc put > him on Zoloft and it made a huge difference in how he handled problems, > but didn’t help the manic episodes and had some not so nice side > affects.  Now I am trying to get him to go to a Psychiatrist and he is > balking.  I told him he needs to have his meds evaluated.

Response:

your husband is fortunate to have such a caring spouse. am not a lesbian but, i want to marry you – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I am new here, and have spent many weeks educating my self on MD from >all your comments. I really appreciate everything you all go through. >I have been an observer of my husbands illness for 13 years.  We have >had so many terrible money problems and behavior issues. I have >finally been able to understand them from the comments I’ve read in >this group and on other web sites.   >I need some advice on how to help my husband.  He has finally accepted >that he has a problem. Almost everyone in his family is on some sort of >anti-depressent and his father committed suicide.  His Family Doc put >him on Zoloft and it made a huge difference in how he handled problems, >but didn’t help the manic episodes and had some not so nice side >affects.  Now I am trying to get him to go to a Psychiatrist and he is >balking.  I told him he needs to have his meds evaluated.   >Here’s my questions: >1.  I’ve made an appt at a University med center (A good hospital). >    He is supposed to meet with a resident then overseen by a PD.   >    Is this wise?  Should we go with a more experienced PD?   >    I want this to be a positive experience for him. >2.  If he doesn’t show up for his appt (like he did today), should I >    go and talk to the PD initially?  Is that appropriate? >3.  Are there any other spouses out there that have been down this >    road and can share their experience? >My husband is a sweet, kind, generous man and I  am so lucky to have >him in my life.  His MD has made his personality what it is, but I hate >to seem him suffer… and the kids and I as a result. We have had such >serious money problems (still do) and he is always gone (trying to fix >the money problems he created).  He goes for days without sleep to the >point he stumbles around and is confused.  He recently ended his >business in order to be home with us more, but now he is very depressed >and doesn’t know what his role is.  I can support our family so I asked >him to take some time off and get healthy.  It’s not working too well. >He feels I am trying to control him too much (I am in a sense, as I’m >trying to set boundries to keep us on a budget).  He needs me to be his >consciense, but I can’t figure out how to do that without being a nag >(which isn’t my nature). I guess I just need to be more patient. >Thanks for any advice you can share.  I tried to keep this short (sorry) >– >Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com >Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

Response:

Hi Kerri, Welcome to ASDM. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I am new here, and have spent many weeks educating my self on MD from all > your comments. I really appreciate everything you all go through. I have > been an observer of my husbands illness for 13 years.  We have had so many > terrible money problems and behavior issues. I have finally been able to > understand them from the comments I’ve read in this group and on other web > sites. > I need some advice on how to help my husband.  He has finally accepted > that he has a problem. Almost everyone in his family is on some sort of > anti-depressent and his father committed suicide.  His Family Doc put him > on Zoloft and it made a huge difference in how he handled problems, but > didn’t help the manic episodes and had some not so nice side affects.  Now > I am trying to get him to go to a Psychiatrist and he is balking.  I told > him he needs to have his meds evaluated. > Here’s my questions: > 1.  I’ve made an appt at a University med center (A good hospital). He is > supposed to meet with a resident then overseen by a PD. Is this wise? > Should we go with a more experienced PD?

IMO, I would consult with a pdoc who is experienced in treating BP illness. >     I want this to be a positive experience for him. 2.  If he doesn’t > show up for his appt (like he did today), should I go and talk to the PD > initially?  Is that appropriate?

Only with your husband’s consent. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 3.  Are there any other spouses out there that have been down this road > and can share their experience? > My husband is a sweet, kind, generous man and I  am so lucky to have him > in my life.  His MD has made his personality what it is, but I hate to > seem him suffer… and the kids and I as a result. We have had such > serious money problems (still do) and he is always gone (trying to fix the > money problems he created).  He goes for days without sleep to the point > he stumbles around and is confused.  He recently ended his business in > order to be home with us more, but now he is very depressed and doesn’t > know what his role is.  I can support our family so I asked him to take > some time off and get healthy.  It’s not working too well. He feels I am > trying to control him too much (I am in a sense, as I’m trying to set > boundries to keep us on a budget).  He needs me to be his consciense, but > I can’t figure out how to do that without being a nag (which isn’t my > nature). I guess I just need to be more patient. > Thanks for any advice you can share.  I tried to keep this short (sorry)

Here are some links for you Kerri: Peace, Support associations accessible on the Internet: The National Depressive and Manic-Depression Association (NDMDA). NDMDA sponsors support groups for manic-depressives and for their families. Our local chapter, the Boulder DMDA, as well as all other DMDA support groups across the country are listed, as well as general information links on manic depression: http://www.ndmda.org/ The National Alliance for the Mentally Ill (NAMI). NAMI offers free seminars for family members in the US and Canada. This organization is geared towards helping the families of the mentally ill. There is a local chapter which meets in Boulder on a regular basis that has a tendency to focus on parents of schizophrenics, but the NAMI charter is broader than that and they welcome families of bipolar patients. http://www.nami.org/family/index.html On-line support for significant others of bipolar patients. There is an online support group for the families, friends, and loved ones of those who have BP: http://www.bpso.org Guidelines for the conservative treatment of Bipolar Disorder ______ The Expert Consensus Guidelines for Treatment of Bipolar Disorder. Expert Knowledge Systems publishes "The Expert Consensus Guidelines for Treatment of Bipolar Disorder." This group is "a knowledge-transfer company dedicated to bringing expert intelligence to bear on critical decision making for government, industry, and the individual. Among its services, EKS creates, validates, and communicates practical clinical guidelines for the improvement of health and the prevention and effective treatment of illness." EKS is led by a distinguished panel of MD’s. The guidelines — written for non-professionals.  The first document published by EKS is "Expert Consensus Treatment Guidelines for Bipolar Disorder: A Guide for Patients and Families." It is relatively non-technical and aimed at non-medical professionals who are attempting to educated themselves about the disorder. This handout is readable, excellent, and comprehensive: Expert Consensus Treatment Guidelines for Bipolar Disorder: A Guide for Patients and Families. (4/17/97) http://www.psychguides.com/eks_bphe.htm The guidelines –written for psychiatrists.  The group also publishes a second, more technical publication, written for psychiatrists. If you want to get into the psychiatric protocol for how medications are selected among the mainstream/conservative choices — the "treatment selection algorithm" — this will help you understand why psychiatrists make the choices they make. The three mood stabilizers recommended are lithium, Depakote and Tegretol. The Expert Consensus Guideline Series: Treatment of Bipolar Disorder. (4/17/97) http://www.psychguides.com/eks_bpgl.htm ______ Less conservative treatments for bipolar disorder ______ More recent treatments for bipolar disorder.  Some bipolar patients do not respond well to the three medication mood stabilizing stand-bys (Lithium, Depakote, and Tegretol). This next article is written for psychiatrists, and discusses the use of two new anti-convulsants, Neurontin and Lamictal. It discusses the advantages and disadvantages in using Lithium in treating bipolar disorder, and the use of anti-convulsants (that probably includes all mood stabilizers except for lithium: Depakote, Tegretol, and the newer anti-convulsants Neurontin and Lamictal) in the treatment of bipopolar disorder. Current Treatments in Bipolar Disorder. (1998) http://www.cme-reviews.com/supplements.html The use of several drugs in combination for treatment of bipolar disorder.  Some psychiatrists prefer using only a few medications in treatment, whereas others prefer the use of many medications in combination. In the following article, also written for psychiatrists, the rationale for using several drugs in combination in refractory (treatment-resistant) bipolar illness is explained: The Role of Complex Combination Therapy in the Treatment of Refractory Bipolar Illness. (undated) http://www.cme-reviews.com/CNS598_post.html/ ______ Medication resources ______ Dr. Ivan’s web page.  For general information about drug treatment for mood disorders, Ivan Goldberg, M.D. provides a great starting point. Dr. Goldberg is a psychiatrist and clinical psychopharmacologist in private practice in New York City. He was formerly on the staff of the National Institute of Mental Health and the Departments of Psychiatry of the Columbia- Presbyterian Medical Center, and Columbia University’s College of Physicians and Surgeons.  On his web page he covers topics such as * Determine if your psychiatrist is truly an expert in psychopharmacology * Foods to avoid when you take an MAO inhibitor * Weight gain from SSRIs * Strategies for the treatment of individuals with Bipolar Disorder * Anticonvulsants as mood stabilizers * Why new drugs behave differently when prescribed than when tested * A guide to psychiatric drug information on the Web Dr. Ivan’s Depression Central — Internet’s central clearing house for information on mood disorders http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.bipolar.html The "gold standard:"  medications for bipolar disorder.  This next article focuses on the most conservative mood-stabilizing drugs lithium, Depakote (valproate), and carbamazepine, the most commonly used medications in the treatment of bipolar disorder. Treatment Options in Bipolar Disorder: Mood Stabilizers. (7/16/97) http://www.medscape.com/Medscape/psychiatry/journal/1997/v02.n07/mh3206. bowden/m h3206.bowden.html Specific information about the 3 main drugs used to treat bipolar disorder. These links discuss each of the 3 major mood stabilizers, Lithium, Depakote, and Tegretol, individually: * (Lithium) http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/lithium.htm * (Depakote) http://www.mediconsult.com/depression/shareware/manic/depa.html * (Tegretol) http://www.mentalhealth.com/drug/p30-t01.html Alternatives to lithium.  Some bipolar patients experience inadequate or no relief of symptoms with standard lithium therapy.  This article talks about alternatives to standard lithium therapy , such as psychotropics, antidepressants, and newer anticonvulsants. Choosing the Appropriate Therapy for Bipolar Disorder. (8/19/97) http://www.medscape.com/Medscape/psychiatry/journal/1997/v02.n08/mh3214. bowden/m h3214.bowden.html The newer anticonvulsants.  Here are links for some of the newer mood stabilizers, Neurontin (Gabapentin), Lamictal (Lamotrigine) Topamax (topiramate), and Verapamil: * (Neurontin) http://psycom.net/depression.central.gabapentin.html * (Lamictal) http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.lamotrigine.html * (Topamax) http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.topiramate.html * (Verapamil) http://uhs.bsd.uchicago.edu/dr-bob/tips/split/Verapamil-for-mania.html Preventing relapses:  Which medications work?  The following article, sponsored by the National Institute of Mental … read more »

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I am new here, and have spent many weeks educating my self on MD from all your comments. I really appreciate everything you all go through. I have been an observer of my husbands illness for 13 years.  We have had so many terrible money problems and behavior issues. I have finally been able to understand them from the comments I’ve read in this group and on other web sites.   I need some advice on how to help my husband.  He has finally accepted that he has a problem. Almost everyone in his family is on some sort of anti-depressent and his father committed suicide.  His Family Doc put him on Zoloft and it made a huge difference in how he handled problems, but didn’t help the manic episodes and had some not so nice side affects.  Now I am trying to get him to go to a Psychiatrist and he is balking.  I told him he needs to have his meds evaluated.   Here’s my questions: 1.  I’ve made an appt at a University med center (A good hospital).     He is supposed to meet with a resident then overseen by a PD.       Is this wise?  Should we go with a more experienced PD?       I want this to be a positive experience for him. 2.  If he doesn’t show up for his appt (like he did today), should I     go and talk to the PD initially?  Is that appropriate? 3.  Are there any other spouses out there that have been down this     road and can share their experience? My husband is a sweet, kind, generous man and I  am so lucky to have him in my life.  His MD has made his personality what it is, but I hate to seem him suffer… and the kids and I as a result. We have had such serious money problems (still do) and he is always gone (trying to fix the money problems he created).  He goes for days without sleep to the point he stumbles around and is confused.  He recently ended his business in order to be home with us more, but now he is very depressed and doesn’t know what his role is.  I can support our family so I asked him to take some time off and get healthy.  It’s not working too well. He feels I am trying to control him too much (I am in a sense, as I’m trying to set boundries to keep us on a budget).  He needs me to be his consciense, but I can’t figure out how to do that without being a nag (which isn’t my nature). I guess I just need to be more patient. Thanks for any advice you can share.  I tried to keep this short (sorry) — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

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Question:

Dear All, Okay..just found out I do have to be intubated for the surgery tomorrow. I hate that as the tube really irritates my throat and I am hoarse for days. I am starting to freak out…I am very scared. The post op period is going to be very painful due to the actual surgical procedure that will be done on both breasts! Since I will be zonked out for a couple of days on pain killers, I won’t be posting but I would love to receive email if any of you would be so kind to send some. My SO will print them out and bring them upstairs to my bedroom for me to read. My pdoc called today since he is worried about me. My depression is worsening and something has to be done. I will see him next Tuesday. I don’t know if we will try Celexa or add another MS like Topomax (which I have but never took) or Lamictal. I am only taking Neurontin now. Historically, ADs do not work for me <sigh>. I gained 2 pounds..yeah!!! My blood work and EKG are fine but they lost my urine sample so I had to drink loads of water, wait for 1 hour and then pee again today while I saw my medical doctor. I swear where the hell is the original sample? I gave it directly to the lab tech last week. Another thought is I hope my results were not given to another patient. Geez!!!! Sooooo….I am asking you all to pray for me as I am worried about tomorrow. Take care and be well. I will try to do the same. Love and peace, — Reach beyond your grasp!

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<Posted and Mailed to Lynda> >Dear All, >Okay..just found out I do have to be intubated for the surgery tomorrow. >I hate that as the tube really irritates my throat and I am hoarse for >days.

I’m sorry to hear that! Seems like there ought to be another way these days. >I am starting to freak out…I am very scared. The post op period is >going to be very painful due to the actual surgical procedure that will >be done on both breasts!

Don’t be reluctant to ask/demand plenty of pain meds! You deserve it! >Since I will be zonked out for a couple of days on pain killers, I won’t >be posting but I would love to receive email if any of you would be so >kind to send some. My SO will print them out and bring them upstairs to >my bedroom for me to read.

Be sure and rest and sleep as much as you can. If there’s a TV&VCR in your bedroom, how about some videos you’ve been meaning to watch? Some good books from the library? Please don’t worry about the BP NGs!!! >My pdoc called today since he is worried about me. My depression is >worsening and something has to be done. I will see him next Tuesday. I >don’t know if we will try Celexa or add another MS like Topomax (which I >have but never took) or Lamictal. I am only taking Neurontin now. >Historically, ADs do not work for me <sigh>.

Considering that you are going to have surgery, I don’t know what to recommend. Celexa has the reputation of having the fewest adverse reactions of the SSRIs– but with your past sensitivity to ADs, I don’t know what to say. >I gained 2 pounds..yeah!!! My blood work and EKG are fine but they lost >my urine sample so I had to drink loads of water, wait for 1 hour and >then pee again today while I saw my medical doctor. I swear where the >hell is the original sample? I gave it directly to the lab tech last >week. Another thought is I hope my results were not given to another >patient. Geez!!!!

<G> >Sooooo….I am asking you all to pray for me as I am worried about >tomorrow.

You got it! But try not to worry! Worrying never did anyone any good! >Take care and be well. >I will try to do the same.

You give it your best shot!!! >Love and peace,

Many blessings and hugs from, James PS I just remembered the info you wanted me to send. I’ll try to round it up while you are recuperating.

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i am new to this sight but found your note from the 8th and wanted to write and wish you well.   warm wishes, kathryn

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> i am new to this sight but found your note from the 8th and wanted to > write and wish you well.

Hi kathryn, The surgery was successful. Thank you for thinking of me. How are you doing? Yours, — Reach beyond your grasp!

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Lynda, One special prayer for Lynda, piping hot, coming right up. God, Spirit, you know better than anyone how hard Lynda is trying and how difficult it has been for her.  Please watch over her during her surgery and during her recovery.  Help her to remember that the surgery may bring her down a little, so if she feels that not to worry.  Let her know that she is very important to many people, and that we are all connected to her in a web of warmth and care. -Gandalf

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Good luck kiddo….and no pinching the drs  :o) let us know how you are doing CJ

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We’ll all pray! Don’t worry (easy enough to say!) – Neil – – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Dear All, >Okay..just found out I do have to be intubated for the surgery tomorrow. >I hate that as the tube really irritates my throat and I am hoarse for >days. >I am starting to freak out…I am very scared. The post op period is >going to be very painful due to the actual surgical procedure that will >be done on both breasts! >Since I will be zonked out for a couple of days on pain killers, I won’t >be posting but I would love to receive email if any of you would be so >kind to send some. My SO will print them out and bring them upstairs to >my bedroom for me to read. >My pdoc called today since he is worried about me. My depression is >worsening and something has to be done. I will see him next Tuesday. I >don’t know if we will try Celexa or add another MS like Topomax (which I >have but never took) or Lamictal. I am only taking Neurontin now. >Historically, ADs do not work for me <sigh>. >I gained 2 pounds..yeah!!! My blood work and EKG are fine but they lost >my urine sample so I had to drink loads of water, wait for 1 hour and >then pee again today while I saw my medical doctor. I swear where the >hell is the original sample? I gave it directly to the lab tech last >week. Another thought is I hope my results were not given to another >patient. Geez!!!! >Sooooo….I am asking you all to pray for me as I am worried about >tomorrow. >Take care and be well. >I will try to do the same. >Love and peace, >– >Reach beyond your grasp!

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Its going to be Okay !!   I know its scarey, and icky and a lot of stuff, but you will be OKAY….  Will email you as much as you would like <S>… We love you dear one…   Angel – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Dear All, > Okay..just found out I do have to be intubated for the surgery tomorrow. > I hate that as the tube really irritates my throat and I am hoarse for > days. > I am starting to freak out…I am very scared.

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Dear Lynda,         My prayers are with you.I wish you a speedy recovery and take God with you.                                     Love,                                      Still Bipolar Susan

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Dear Lynda, thoughts of you and your surgerical work will be on my troubled mind, get outta that hospital as quick as possible and back home to the soup pots.  Hope the results are favorable…..pray the results are favorable. LW – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Dear All, >Okay..just found out I do have to be intubated for the surgery tomorrow. >I hate that as the tube really irritates my throat and I am hoarse for >days. >I am starting to freak out…I am very scared. The post op period is >going to be very painful due to the actual surgical procedure that will >be done on both breasts! >Since I will be zonked out for a couple of days on pain killers, I won’t >be posting but I would love to receive email if any of you would be so >kind to send some. My SO will print them out and bring them upstairs to >my bedroom for me to read. >My pdoc called today since he is worried about me. My depression is >worsening and something has to be done. I will see him next Tuesday. I >don’t know if we will try Celexa or add another MS like Topomax (which I >have but never took) or Lamictal. I am only taking Neurontin now. >Historically, ADs do not work for me <sigh>. >I gained 2 pounds..yeah!!! My blood work and EKG are fine but they lost >my urine sample so I had to drink loads of water, wait for 1 hour and >then pee again today while I saw my medical doctor. I swear where the >hell is the original sample? I gave it directly to the lab tech last >week. Another thought is I hope my results were not given to another >patient. Geez!!!! >Sooooo….I am asking you all to pray for me as I am worried about >tomorrow. >Take care and be well. >I will try to do the same. >Love and peace, >– >Reach beyond your grasp!

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Question:

YOUR DOCTOR SOUNDS LIKE AN ASSHOLE

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>> > Please talk with your pdoc about this issue. > I called him and he said to take 20 mg of Prozac a day and also the > Wellbutrin, but to take Klonopin if I feel like climbing the walls….. >This would be for OCD I forgot to add.  He doesn’t want to eliminate the >Prozac completely. > Didn’t I post about my concern about you going off Prozac altogether > since it is not only effective for depression but also for OCD (and > bulimia)? But I don’t see my post. Maybe I’m losing it??? I guess it’s > time to up my Neurontin dose. <Sigh

You are not losing it at all.  That was what prompted me to question the pdoc’s decision.  I am not sure that he was aware of the OCD, but he is now.   Don’t up the Neurontin sweets, I am the one that is losing it. With Love, Julie

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<Posted and Mailed to Julez> > >> > Please talk with your pdoc about this issue. > > I called him and he said to take 20 mg of Prozac a day and also the > > Wellbutrin, but to take Klonopin if I feel like climbing the walls….. > >This would be for OCD I forgot to add.  He doesn’t want to eliminate the > >Prozac completely. > Didn’t I post about my concern about you going off Prozac altogether > since it is not only effective for depression but also for OCD (and > bulimia)? But I don’t see my post. Maybe I’m losing it??? I guess it’s > time to up my Neurontin dose. <Sigh!> >You are not losing it at all.  That was what prompted me to question the >pdoc’s decision.  I am not sure that he was aware of the OCD, but he is >now.   >Don’t up the Neurontin sweets, I am the one that is losing it.

I figured out what happened. I use Agent (which is an integrated News reader and email program). I must have clicked upon the email only reply button. So that is why it didn’t get posted. DUH! You may find that the antidepressive effects of Neurontin will decrease after a few days and leave predominantly the mood stabilizing effect. >With Love, >Julie

Lots of love from, James

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> What I have been told by my doctores is this:  Prozac is not a long lasting > pill, so going off it ‘cold turkey’ can’t hurt you at all….  we either

My doc said the same thing due to the long half life and the build-up in my system. > take it and feel the effects, or when we stop we just stop…..  This might > be wrong info, but I wanted to let you  know they did that with me and I > didn’t feel any differance…. it did however take a lot longer when they > put me on it again to get it into my system.  I hope you do ok, this ride > is hell sometimes. Angel

Thanks Angel – your name suits you perfectly! Julie

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   (I wrote) My question is: when switching to a new SSRI, and going cold turkey off the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal effects?  I know, your body may vary : ) > The half life of Prozac is 2 – 3 days. Norfloxetine, the primary active > metabolite, has an elimination rate half life of 7 – 9 days. It is > excreted by the kidneys and metabolized primarily in the liver. > IMHO, stopping Prozac abruptly while starting Wellbutrin has the > potential of triggering a mania as Prozac is still in your system. The > half life of Wellbutrin is 8 – 24 hours. It is also excreted via the > kidneys and metabolized in the liver.

Right as usual kiddo, manic is the story of my life since OCTOBER, in varying degrees.  This brought it on pretty good. > Both drugs should be used with caution in peoplw who have impaired renal > or liver disease. > Please talk with your pdoc about this issue.

I called him and he said to take 20 mgs of prozac a day and also the wellbutrin, but to take klonopin if I feel like climbing the walls….. hmmmm Thanks Lynda, hope you are feeling better! Julie

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> > Please talk with your pdoc about this issue.

 I called him and he said to take 20 mgs of prozac a day and also the  wellbutrin, but to take klonopin if I feel like climbing the walls….. This would be for OCD I forgot to add.  He doesn’t want to eliminate the prozac completely. Julie

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<Posted and Mailed to Julez> > > Please talk with your pdoc about this issue. > I called him and he said to take 20 mg of Prozac a day and also the > Wellbutrin, but to take Klonopin if I feel like climbing the walls….. >This would be for OCD I forgot to add.  He doesn’t want to eliminate the >Prozac completely.

Didn’t I post about my concern about you going off Prozac altogether since it is not only effective for depression but also for OCD (and bulimia)? But I don’t see my post. Maybe I’m losing it??? I guess it’s time to up my Neurontin dose. <Sigh!> >Julie

James — the Puzzled

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Tapering off is really just a formality with Prozac. It takes so long to leave your body that quitting abruptly shouldn’t be a problem. Still, if in doubt, taper. Keith – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hey There: >I haven’t been following the group for about a week…. I need to catch >up : ) >I took prozac successfully for six months. For some strange reason, it >has me smoking cigarette’s again, after quitting for 2 whole years!!! >Also on (Neurontin and Klonopin)…. >My Doctor stopped the Prozac cold turkey, (ouch,) and now has me on >wellbutrin instead. >My question is: when switching to a new SSRI, and going cold turkey off >the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal >effects?  I know, your body may vary : ) >Any experience out there – Please let me know. >Thanks. >Julie

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>What I have been told by my doctores is this:  Prozac is not a long lasting >pill, so going off it ‘cold turkey’ can’t hurt you at all….  we either >take it and feel the effects, or when we stop we just stop…..  This might >be wrong info, but I wanted to let you  know they did that with me and I >didn’t feel any difference…. it did however take a lot longer when they >put me on it again to get it into my system.  I hope you do ok, this ride >is hell sometimes. Angel

Angel, I have to disagree with your doctors. The effects of Prozac do stay with a person for a considerable period of time. It is well known that when a person "rechallenges" any particular medication, it may not prove as effective as it originally did. Some tolerance or resistance may be built up. http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/fluoxetine_cp.htm Accumulation and Slow Elimination — The relatively slow elimination of fluoxetine (elimination half-life of 1 to 3 days after acute administration and 4 to 6 days after chronic administration) and its active metabolite, norfluoxetine (elimination half-life of 4 to 16 days after acute and chronic administration), leads to significant accumulation of these active species in chronic use and delayed attainment of steady state, even when a fixed dose is used. After 30 days of dosing at 40 mg/day, plasma concentrations of fluoxetine in the range of 91 to 302 ng/mL and norfluoxetine in the range of 72 to 258 ng/mL have been observed. Plasma concentrations of fluoxetine were higher than those predicted by single-dose studies, because fluoxetine’s metabolism is not proportional to dose. Norfluoxetine, however, appears to have linear pharmacokinetics. Its mean terminal half-life after a single dose was 8.6 days and after multiple dosing was 9.3 days. Steady state levels after prolonged dosing are similar to levels seen at 4-5 weeks. The long elimination half-lives of fluoxetine and norfluoxetine assure that, even when dosing is stopped, active drug substance will persist in the body for weeks (primarily depending on individual patient characteristics, previous dosing regimen, and length of previous therapy at discontinuation). This is of potential consequence when drug discontinuation is required or when drugs are prescribed that might interact with fluoxetine and norfluoxetine following the discontinuation of Prozac. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hey There: > I haven’t been following the group for about a week…. I need to catch > up : ) > I took Prozac successfully for six months. For some strange reason, it > has me smoking cigarette’s again, after quitting for 2 whole years!!! > Also on (Neurontin and Klonopin)…. > My Doctor stopped the Prozac cold turkey, (ouch,) and now has me on > Wellbutrin instead. > My question is: when switching to a new SSRI, and going cold turkey off > the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal > effects?  I know, your body may vary : ) > Any experience out there – Please let me know. > Thanks. > Julie

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Hi Julez, > I took prozac successfully for six months. For some strange reason, it has > me smoking cigarette’s again, after quitting for 2 whole years!!!

Sorry about that. > Also on (Neurontin and Klonopin)…. > My Doctor stopped the Prozac cold turkey, (ouch,) and now has me on > wellbutrin instead. > My question is: when switching to a new SSRI, and going cold turkey off > the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal > effects?  I know, your body may vary : )

The half life of Prozac is 2 – 3 days. Norfloxetine, the primary active metabolite, has an elimination rate half life of 7 – 9 days. It is excreted by the kidneys and metabolized primarily in the liver. IMHO, stopping Prozac abruptly while starting Wellbutrin has the potential of triggering a mania as Prozac is still in your system. The half life of Wellbutrin is 8 – 24 hours. It is also excreted via the kidneys and metabolized in the liver. Both drugs should be used with caution in peoplw who have impaired renal or liver disease. Please talk with your pdoc about this issue. Peace, Reach beyond your grasp!

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What I have been told by my doctores is this:  Prozac is not a long lasting pill, so going off it ‘cold turkey’ can’t hurt you at all….  we either take it and feel the effects, or when we stop we just stop…..  This might be wrong info, but I wanted to let you  know they did that with me and I didn’t feel any differance…. it did however take a lot longer when they put me on it again to get it into my system.  I hope you do ok, this ride is hell sometimes. Angel – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hey There: > I haven’t been following the group for about a week…. I need to catch > up : ) > I took prozac successfully for six months. For some strange reason, it > has me smoking cigarette’s again, after quitting for 2 whole years!!! > Also on (Neurontin and Klonopin)…. > My Doctor stopped the Prozac cold turkey, (ouch,) and now has me on > wellbutrin instead. > My question is: when switching to a new SSRI, and going cold turkey off > the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal > effects?  I know, your body may vary : ) > Any experience out there – Please let me know. > Thanks. > Julie

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<Posted and Mailed to Julez> >Hey There: >I haven’t been following the group for about a week…. I need to catch >up : ) >I took Prozac successfully for six months. For some strange reason, it >has me smoking cigarette’s again, after quitting for 2 whole years!!! >Also on (Neurontin and Klonopin)….

Are you sure that you resuming smoking is due to Prozac rather than some additional stressor in your life? >My Doctor stopped the Prozac cold turkey, (ouch,) and now has me on >Wellbutrin instead.

You have been on Prozac long enough for it to have built up to a steady state in your system. It is NOT a good idea to go off it cold turkey!!! The effects will remain with you for quite a while I’m afraid. The reason for switching to Wellbutrin is sound IMO. It is the same as Zyban — the antismoking pill you see advertised. I hope it adds in reducing your cravings for nicotine. >My question is: when switching to a new SSRI,

Prozac is an SSRI but Wellbutrin is not — it affects dopamine. >and going cold turkey off >the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal >effects?  I know, your body may vary : )

Maybe? Also are you cutting back on smoking, wearing a nicotine patch, chewing nicotine gum, or what??? All of these will effect how you will feel. >Any experience out there – Please let me know.

I’ve never had problems with nicotine, alcohol, or illegal drugs so I’m afraid I can’t give any personal experiences in any of those areas. >Thanks. >Julie

Best wishes for success from, James

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Hey There: I haven’t been following the group for about a week…. I need to catch up : ) I took prozac successfully for six months. For some strange reason, it has me smoking cigarette’s again, after quitting for 2 whole years!!! Also on (Neurontin and Klonopin)…. My Doctor stopped the Prozac cold turkey, (ouch,) and now has me on wellbutrin instead. My question is: when switching to a new SSRI, and going cold turkey off the Prozac at the same time, can I still expect some heavy withdrawal effects?  I know, your body may vary : ) Any experience out there – Please let me know. Thanks. Julie

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