SSRIs

Question:

For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could this be related to going off the neurontin? Michele

Response:

Heya, Michelle,     Yeah, definitely. It’s not a good thing to do, at all. I understand you were kinda forced to, but you coulda had a major seizure.      Not chewing you out, ‘cuz I went off prednisone all at once myself, due to non-stop bleeding. Another no-no. I knew I was risking having a psychotic episode, but I figured who could tell? I also risked having my adrenals fail. Shame on us both, huh?      The neurontin’s working well for me and I’m aware it’s one of the ones to titer down from. Hope you’re aware of that now, too. Whoops! Hugs from Rosie — "If you wanna get it done, you gotta fight for yourself."  – Meat Loaf, Bat Outta Hell II

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a > day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken > the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it > until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, > feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could > this be related to going off the neurontin? > Michele

Response:

>For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a >day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken >the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it >until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, >feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could >this be related to going off the neurontin? >Michele

I had mood problems when I went off Neurontin (rage mostly), so my personal response is yes it "could" be related.  I’ve seen others post of mood disturbances when coming off too, though most don’t seem to have the problem. – Jen

Response:

From what I’ve experienced (myself and with my kids),  about all of the neurologic (including psychiatric) medications should not be discontinued suddenly. Interesting note.  About a year ago, I had to take an antibiotic for a week or so that looked kind of like the Prozac that I take daily.  For two days, I didn’t realize that I wasn’t taking my dose of prozac in the morning with my other meds. (I’d look in my hand, see the green and white pill and I figured that I was okay, still not awake enough to realize that it was the antibiotic, not the prozac.)  I got pretty depressed after just two days, then at night after those days, as I was taking the antibiotic I realized that I’d missed the prozac.  This wasn’t a placebo affect thing – I didn’t know that I wasn’t taking it – but I did notice that I was really down.  I hurried and took my prozac and haven’t missed a day since. I talked to my psychiatrist and told him of the event.  Researchers have noticed a change in mood with just one day being missed of the SSRIs like Prozac.  Kind of wild – it takes 4-6 weeks to work, but the small change in blood level from just one day being missed. To me it was just more evidence of my body’s need for the medicine. Depression is a physical illness. Sorry for rambling.  Be careful with the meds.  We’ve all done what you have done.  (I did it with blood pressure medicine when first married – wanted to wait until payday.  My wife got pretty upset with me – I guess she wanted me to stick around.) Sorry to ramble. Martin

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a > day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken > the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it > until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, > feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could > this be related to going off the neurontin? > Michele

Response:

>For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a >day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken >the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it >until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, >feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could >this be related to going off the neurontin? >Michele

It certainly could have been the neurontin Michele.  Neurontin is one of those medicines a person should not stop taking all at once.  I know you couldn’t help it this time. Neurontin should be tapered slowly to withdraw from.  I guess the worst thing it can cause is seizures.  Seems rather odd since it is an anti-seizure medicine huh? I take 600mg of neurontin 2 x’s a day and then 900mg at bedtime.  My doctor rx’d 900mg 3 times a day, but I couldn’t handle feeling sleepy without being able to sleep, so I talked with him and we changed it to the 600mg and 900 mg. Still get sleepy during the day, but with my weird sleeping habits any more, it doesn’t really matter. Sue We survive together or not at all.

Response:

I think that the big seizure risk for many of these medicines in ceasing them is because they are used  by people with epilepsy to control seizures. Without the seizure control medication, there is nothing to control the epilepsy, therefore the risk of seizures becomes higher. Some medications (such as Klonopin – aka clonazepam – benzodiazapine used for anxiety but also for seizures) will cause anybody seizures if stopped suddenly after being used for awhile. Key is to not run out of the medicine and to not cease it without medical supervision.  (I’m not being judgemental – I certainly have done that before!!  In a perfect world the medical supervision would be available without judgement and the financial worries wouldn’t exist.)  Same holds true for the long term pain meds – but how many of us have been left stranded by our docs – but that is a different subject. Martin

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a >day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken >the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it >until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, >feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could >this be related to going off the neurontin? >Michele > It certainly could have been the neurontin Michele.  Neurontin is one of those > medicines a person should not stop taking all at once.  I know you couldn’t > help it this time. > Neurontin should be tapered slowly to withdraw from.  I guess the worst thing > it can cause is seizures.  Seems rather odd since it is an anti-seizure > medicine huh? > I take 600mg of neurontin 2 x’s a day and then 900mg at bedtime.  My doctor > rx’d 900mg 3 times a day, but I couldn’t handle feeling sleepy without being > able to sleep, so I talked with him and we changed it to the 600mg and 900 mg. > Still get sleepy during the day, but with my weird sleeping habits any more, it > doesn’t really matter. > Sue > We survive together or not at all.

Response:

>I think that the big seizure risk for many of these medicines in ceasing >them is because they are used  by people with epilepsy to control seizures. >Without the seizure control

Actually it is simpler than that….these meds "lower the seizure threshold"…ie makes it "easier" for one to have a seizure …don’t ask me the mechanism..cuz I surely don’t understand it either!!!  So once your brain gets "used to" these anti seizure meds (even if you were never prone to seizures)…if you stop abruptly…boom..you may well have a seizure!!!  so the gradual taper is the way to avoid..hopefully the risk of having seizure!!! phew…talk about creating a problem where one never existed!! rb Hawki

Response:

I can not take prozac.  It makes me paranoid.  Man I thought my world was coming to an end.  I thought I was faking my pain and everything.  I thought I was going to jail. I was confessing I was faking everything.  I was plain an simple not faking at all.  I started throwing up come to find out my gallbladder needed to be removed.  They put me in the hospital because I was dehydrated.  I could not remember to ask the doc for my prozac.  When I did the nurse’s would say they would call him.  On the 3rd day my paranoia started to let up.  Now they will not give me any AD drugs in fear it will bring it on again.  To some it is a God sent drug to some it is a suicide drug.  I truly can see why it got the bad publicity it did when it first came out.  I used to think it was a great pill.  If you ever start feeling paranoid talk to your doc immediately PLEASE.  I mean drive as fast as u can to the doctor or ER.  It is one bad drug for me.  I took that drug for years and felt great.  Then all of sudden it hit me like a ton of bricks.  It was not a pleasant experience. Bonner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> From what I’ve experienced (myself and with my kids),  about all of the > neurologic (including psychiatric) medications should not be discontinued > suddenly. > Interesting note.  About a year ago, I had to take an antibiotic for a week > or so that looked kind of like the Prozac that I take daily.  For two days, > I didn’t realize that I wasn’t taking my dose of prozac in the morning with > my other meds. (I’d look in my hand, see the green and white pill and I > figured that I was okay, still not awake enough to realize that it was the > antibiotic, not the prozac.)  I got pretty depressed after just two days, > then at night after those days, as I was taking the antibiotic I realized > that I’d missed the prozac.  This wasn’t a placebo affect thing – I didn’t > know that I wasn’t taking it – but I did notice that I was really down.  I > hurried and took my prozac and haven’t missed a day since. > I talked to my psychiatrist and told him of the event.  Researchers have > noticed a change in mood with just one day being missed of the SSRIs like > Prozac.  Kind of wild – it takes 4-6 weeks to work, but the small change in > blood level from just one day being missed. > To me it was just more evidence of my body’s need for the medicine. > Depression is a physical illness. > Sorry for rambling.  Be careful with the meds.  We’ve all done what you have > done.  (I did it with blood pressure medicine when first married – wanted to > wait until payday.  My wife got pretty upset with me – I guess she wanted me > to stick around.) > Sorry to ramble. > Martin > For the past 3 months I’ve been taking 300 mg of neurontin twice a > day, to help with pain related to a compressed nerve. I haven’t taken > the neurontin over the past 4 days- scrip ran out and I didn’t fill it > until today. Over the weekend, I had some terrible crying jags, > feelings of anxiety (I’m on elavil for depression), jitteriness. Could > this be related to going off the neurontin? > Michele

Response:

Question:

A few days ago I started taking CELEXA to treat depression.  For the past several years I have been taking about 25 tablets of Dramine everyday.  I am not concerned with the side effects.  I am worried that this will prevent the Celexa from working.  Does anyone know/

Response:

There have been no studies about the effects of diphenhydramine and caffeine, the major metabolites of dimenhydrinate, and citalopram. Metabolic drug interactions can cause blood levels of either drug to be lowered or raised. These three drugs work on different receptors in the brain, so theoretically there should not be problems in that area. As a curious and nosy person, may I inquire as to why you take 20 tablets of dimenhydrinate daily, and what effect it has on you.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> A few days ago I started taking CELEXA to treat depression.  For the past > several years I have been taking about 25 tablets of Dramine everyday.  I am > not concerned with the side effects.  I am worried that this will prevent > the Celexa from working.  Does anyone know/

Response:

Question:

I have recently been placed on 50mg of Zoloft/day for my depression. For the first two days I had a constant erection, which has now subsided. I am now at day 10. However, I have noticed that now I cannot reach orgasm and my penis has grown. Does anyone here have any input on what I can do about this problem? Has anyone else experienced these types of change? I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)?

Response:

>I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like >I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was >nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this >so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I >stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. >What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)?

Never tried Zoloft but the first time I tried Prozac it induced what felt exactly like an LSD flashback, and just like previous flashbacks it caused my left pupil to dilate.  I tried Prozac several times after (in a recreational attempt) but the sensation never recurred.

Response:

> >I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like >I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was >nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this >so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I >stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. >What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)? > Never tried Zoloft but the first time I tried Prozac it induced what > felt exactly like an LSD flashback, and just like previous flashbacks > it caused my left pupil to dilate.  I tried Prozac several times > after (in a recreational attempt) but the sensation never recurred.

I got the same thing!  The first time I was on Prozac, I had LSD type feelings for almost a week at the beginning.  It was unsettling, but not unpleasant. I have also been on Wellbutrin and Celexa over the years.  Wellbutrin didn’t have the LSD effect.  Celexa had intense "body rushes" for the first week. Anyone know why an antidepressant would trigger LSD type feelings?

Response:

http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~ivl/writing/non_fiction/lsd/

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like > >I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was > >nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this > >so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I > >stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. > >What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)? > Never tried Zoloft but the first time I tried Prozac it induced what > felt exactly like an LSD flashback, and just like previous flashbacks > it caused my left pupil to dilate.  I tried Prozac several times > after (in a recreational attempt) but the sensation never recurred. > I got the same thing!  The first time I was on Prozac, I had LSD type > feelings for almost a week at the beginning.  It was unsettling, but not > unpleasant. > I have also been on Wellbutrin and Celexa over the years.  Wellbutrin > didn’t have the LSD effect.  Celexa had intense "body rushes" for the > first week. > Anyone know why an antidepressant would trigger LSD type feelings?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like > >I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was > >nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this > >so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I > >stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. > >What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)? > Never tried Zoloft but the first time I tried Prozac it induced what > felt exactly like an LSD flashback, and just like previous flashbacks > it caused my left pupil to dilate.  I tried Prozac several times > after (in a recreational attempt) but the sensation never recurred. >I got the same thing!  The first time I was on Prozac, I had LSD type >feelings for almost a week at the beginning.  It was unsettling, but not >unpleasant. >I have also been on Wellbutrin and Celexa over the years.  Wellbutrin >didn’t have the LSD effect.  Celexa had intense "body rushes" for the >first week. >Anyone know why an antidepressant would trigger LSD type feelings?

This fellow drug eater might. They often use SSRIs etc for "trips" it would seem http://users.lycaeum.org/~mort/lsd_05.html [BACKGROUND] So, it’s Thanksgiving Break. I’ve been pretty goddamn bored, spending my time toking. Tuesday rolls around. Standard day. Phone call at one from a friend, who we’ll call H. H and J, my best friend, are coming over, or something. I figure a change of routine will provide an escape from my chronic ennui, so I say ok. Half an hour later, they’re over. Big surprise, though: H gives me 2 hits of acid. Liquid dropped onto a Sweet Tart, or so he claims. I figure it’s probably more like 1 hit, but what the fuck. I buy another 2 hit sweettart from H, as I find low-hit trips to be pretty banal. I also make some impromptu plans. My older brother was flying in Wednesday, and would be here till sunday, so Tuesday was the last night I had before spring break. It was set, then: I would trip that night. J couldn’t come, so it was going to be solo. I’d been wanting to try tripping solo for a while, so I was set, pretty much. Again, I was a bit concerned over whether the acid would work or not. H isn’t really a dealer, but the stuff he gets tends to be of questionable quality. And there was my SSRI’s, 50mg sertraline a day, had been doing it for about two months. I figure that the worst that could happen is that nothing works, and I waste $10. I’d tripped before with the SSRI’s once, but there was also a time when I ate a hit and nothing happened. Ah well. H and I left around 3. I had an appointment at 4, so I took care of that. Coming home, I remembered I’d forgotten to take that day’s dose of sertraline; fixed that. It was around 5. Ate a small dinner at 6. I planned to drop about 7:30-8:00, as with the SSRIs acid seemed to take longer to kick in. I also considered taking some Adderall – a cocktail of pharmaceutical (dextro-)amphetamine salts – with the acid, as I’d heard good things about acid with amphetamines; from what I’d heard, it was nothing like speedy acid. On the contrary, speed takes the edge off acid a bit. It was worth a shot, and I’d had virtually nothing but positive experience with adderall. I gave it a go. After eating dinner, I performed some informal meditation. I’d learned about the importance of set and setting my last trip, and I was determined to make this a positive experience. I cogitated for a bit on what I wanted to achieve with this trip. Now, I’ll go into a bit of background. During the summer, I had a pretty steady flow of cash from an informal job (working for my parent’s business, heh), so money for drugs was no problem. I also wasn’t into pot, in the beginning of the summer anyway. So basically, I had both the money and the time for frequent tripping. I built a lot of experience in those 3 months, but due to some really bad circumstances in August – friend flipping out, parents finding out about drugs – I had to stop indefinitely. Money was also an issue. I was put on sertraline, aka Zoloft, for depression. Fucked around with benzos for a while. Fucked around with ritalin for a while. Then finally, a few weeks ago, I amassed four hits from various sources and daytripped at the Renaissance Fair. It was so different; acid really does seem to change character immensely from trip to trip. While it was quantitavely in the vicinity of 4 hits, it was much different qualitavely, especially the visual aspect. Tripping in broad daylight, something I’d only done with 1.5 hits, might have had something to do with it also. Anyway, I found myself with the opportunity for a classic trip. Maybe would even resemble my first time (which was also solo). I decided that my goals were: [SET] -to further gauge the impact of SSRI’s on acid -to attempt to understand the meaning of a lot of music I’d wanted to listen to whilst frying -to experiment with the acid/adderall combo -to further experiment with the acid/marijuana combo; had done this many times, but they were before I had overly psychedelic effects from pot; -and to use the perspective endowed on me to scope my current position in life, to evaluate where I want to go from here. [SETTING] was going to be my house (primarily, my room), which was where I’d spent almost all of my trips. I figured I’d be off baseline by 9 and peak around 1. I had no idea how/if I was going to get to sleep. My parents wake up early, but they both work. I figured I’d get in bed around 6 am, and either sleep or just trip in bed until my parents got out of the house, which would have been 7-7:30. I had free reign from then until noon or so. I was running low on pot, but I was counting on using all of it that night; I figured I’d sedate myself with mass quantities of it if I really really couldn’t sleep. And, in the event of disaster, I had a milligram of klonopin. I hate the benzo feeling with a passion, but it’s nice to know that there IS a panic button. Shortly before taking the acid, I was hit by a sudden attack of anxiety. Was really weird. I was nervous as hell, but not about anything in particular. It’s not like I was apprehensive about the trip at all; I had all this anxiety, but it was unfocused, not directed towards anything. I took a shit, smoked a cigarette, and it cleared up. [NARRATIVE ^ 11/23/99] 21:10: I take 30mg of Adderall. I had wanted to get this out of the way as early as possible, as it really, really impedes sleep, and I did NOT need that. 21:25: I eat the acid. As mentioned, it was in the form of sweet-tarts. I crunched both of them up and swallowed them. Yum. The quality of said acid was extremely dubitous; H had gotten it from some stranger. One of those guys that claims to make his own acid with moldy rye bread. H claimed that it was good stuff, but he’s said that about a lot of things. 21:25-22:00: I kill time. IRC, guitar. The adderall appeared quite early, maybe around 7:35, 7:40. It put me in a naturally good and stimulated state of mind, which is what I’d been hoping; I anticipated that the adderall would set the stage for the acid and allow a more positive experience. I did have a concern about acid and adderall. Adderall, and Ritalin too, for that matter, turns me into a person I don’t like. With Ritalin (which I stopped doing altogether a while ago), I didn’t notice when I was on it, but as I came down I saw what a prick I’d been. I actually had a lot of personal revelations and insights on a really horrible Rit comedown; they were almost entheogenic in their depth, but unfortunately they didn’t really last that long. That’s a different story, though. Anyway, Adderall makes me a manipulative dick as well, but it allows me to see this, unlike Ritalin. I was worried that the ego dissolution of the acid would do bad things with the ego strengthening of the adderall. As the adderall was starting to kick in, I remembered having absentmindedly taken that sertraline a few hours ago. Fuck! I wasn’t sure if SSRIs inhibited acid short-term; like, if taking an SSRI neutralizes acid. I hoped it didn’t. The time I’d tripped with SSRI’s before, I had refrained from taking my daily dose. 20:00-22:00: Phone rings at 8. It’s H. He’s been kicked out of his house, and needs a place to stay the night. He apparently hadn’t had permission to hang out with us earlier, and his parents are fascists. I didn’t want to get into their business, so I made it clear with him that I was just making sure he had a place to stay for the night. My parents didn’t mind at all, so here I am, driving over to pick up a friend who’s been kicked out of his house while waiting for 4 hits of acid to kick in. Nice. I pick him up, drive back home. We did a bunch of pedestrian stuff; ate, I played guitar for a bit, yadda yadda. The adderall was making me talkative as a mofo, so I was expounding drug knowledge to H, who is, unfortunately, rather tardly as far as believing urban drug myths goes. I educated him on the nature of the drug war and on various rare psychedelics. My state of mind at this point was all waiting. I was waiting for that bizarre acid weirdness, and I wasn’t getting it. I *was* getting extremely vague hallucinations and such, but hey, it was probably because I was looking for them. My analysis of the situation was that the lifting-off feel of the acid was overshadowed by the adderall, which would explain why I had virtually no mental effects, but mild visual effects. 22:45: H and I go out in the backyard to spark a bowl. We have some trouble getting started – it’s windy, my lighters stink, and we had to change a screen – but we … read more »

Response:

I found I grew a third testicle.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I have recently been placed on 50mg of Zoloft/day for my depression. For the > first two days I had a constant erection, which has now subsided. I am now > at day 10. However, I have noticed that now I cannot reach orgasm and my > penis has grown. Does anyone here have any input on what I can do about this > problem? Has anyone else experienced these types of change? > I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like > I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was > nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this > so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I > stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. > What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)?

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I have recently been placed on 50mg of Zoloft/day for my depression. For the > first two days I had a constant erection, which has now subsided. I am now > at day 10. However, I have noticed that now I cannot reach orgasm and my > penis has grown. Does anyone here have any input on what I can do about this > problem? Has anyone else experienced these types of change? > I really haven’t noticed any changes in my mood except that now i feel like > I’ve consumed a low dose of LSD. The first two days were horrible. I was > nausiated and jittery. I couldn’t concentrate. I was taking ReVia with this > so I would not be inclined to drink, but that pill makes me feel awful. I > stopped taking Revia on day three and things have gotten a little better. > What else can I expect from this/these drug(s)?

you can expect Adverse Reactions Zoloft may cause the following reactions: fast heart rate, palpitations dizziness or lightheadedness fast talking, excited feelings skin rash, itching (hives) unusual tiredness or weakness confusion flushing sweating muscle spasms nausea, vomiting diarrhea decreased appetite weight loss dry mouth vaginitis insomnia headache indigestion, fatigue insomnia nervousness stupor please note Interactions with Drugs and Other Substances Drugs or substances that may interact with Zoloft are: illicit drugs (LSD, cocaine, methamphetamine) http://www.whatmeds.com/meds/zyprexa.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Question:

I know an arse. Who thinks changing the clock is going to make this crap stick. Count Down Begins. why bother?

Response:

Just one opinion, but I think your conspiracy theory is absurd.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> please correct your date.  You’re top-posting. > — > I know a man who saw God so clearly that he lost all faith. > — Aegidius of Assisi quoted in "The Silent Cry" by Dorothee Soelle > I hope that after I die, people will say of me: ‘That guy sure owed me a > lot > of money.’ > – Jack Handey > Dear Group > Greetings. I am a bipolar disordered individual who is finding this group > absolutely superb. Whereas most groups waste your time with irrelevancies > and indulgences, this group is substance to the max, and bears witness > therefore to the perception that we sufferers of bipolarity and allied > conditions lack nothing in depth. > I was only diagnosed last Nov. after a severe experience where depression > triggered a profound mystical opening (this has been the pattern of my > life). Essentially my perception is that what we ’suffer’ from is foremost > a > spiritual affliction, a kind of inability to adjust our frequencies to > those > of the majority, whose own more conditioned frequencies tend to fall > within > agreeable parameters for the easy management of the soceity > they create and further condition. > I feel very strongly – and you are most welcome to agree, disagree or > otherwise feed back – that the appearance of SSRIs such as Prozac and > other > such ‘upper downers’ (my term, I even wrote a song about it;) > are the establishment response to the challenge of the restlessness of the > middle class white population in the wake of the societal upheavals of the > late 60s and early 70s. Look at it this way (and this is highly > theoretical, > if a little too credible to dismiss): In the late 60s and early 70s the > unrest in the West, esp. in the West, amongst the white middle class – > which > was unprecedented in its style and content – must have been very > concerning > to the control structure. They had already started dealing with some > success > with the problems of > ethnic minority rebellion by running hard, highly addictive drugs into > inner > city areas, etc (this is now a matter of record) thus turning the > rebellious > energy in on itself. But what to do with the more ‘important’ middle class > strata of society, who were also showing signs of discontent and unease? > The control structure realised that different rules had to apply for this > latter group. Hence the arising of a new kind of addictive and, if > anything, > even more insidious kind of drug. A kind of drug that would desensitise, > render more submissive, and crucially undermine spiritual aspects of the > human being (which are causal in the kind of unrest seen as necessary to > suppress) whilst leaving most users able to function as needed for society > at large to continue to endorse and support the control structure. Eureka! > SSRIs! Prozac!! Cipramil!! Zispin!! Miracle drugs (sic) to treat > ‘depression’ which is in any case often just a nautral process of > spiritual > awakening where the initial symptoms of a change of awareness and > consciousness – the coming to awareness first of the negative energy > forms – > that would eventually, if treated intelligently, give way to new growth in > the mind, body and spirit, are instead hammered ruthlessly into clinical > negatives. > Is this mad raving? Conspiracy theory?? I doubt it. As a sufferer for a > quarter century from bipolarity I am not ‘blaming anybody’ and I am > realist. > All I am saying is that it seems a little uncanny that all these Prozac > drugs and their boosters appeared when they did. This is a form of > spiritual > warfare we’re seeing, and it is intensifying. The economic battle is won. > Now the battle for our souls has begun. Literally. Even TV, MTV, video > games, movies, and all the other paraphenalia of distraction has not been > enough to > deter awakening awareness at this time. The ‘drugs’ are the best hope > ‘they’ > have of making ‘us’ them. > Comments welcome…and thanx for a magnificent resource and > support…Cybermystic

Response:

Don’t forget the shadow prez is on prozac.

Response:

please correct your date.  You’re top-posting. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> — > I know a man who saw God so clearly that he lost all faith. > — Aegidius of Assisi quoted in "The Silent Cry" by Dorothee Soelle > I hope that after I die, people will say of me: ‘That guy sure owed me a lot > of money.’ > – Jack Handey > Dear Group > Greetings. I am a bipolar disordered individual who is finding this group > absolutely superb. Whereas most groups waste your time with irrelevancies > and indulgences, this group is substance to the max, and bears witness > therefore to the perception that we sufferers of bipolarity and allied > conditions lack nothing in depth. > I was only diagnosed last Nov. after a severe experience where depression > triggered a profound mystical opening (this has been the pattern of my > life). Essentially my perception is that what we ’suffer’ from is foremost a > spiritual affliction, a kind of inability to adjust our frequencies to those > of the majority, whose own more conditioned frequencies tend to fall within > agreeable parameters for the easy management of the soceity > they create and further condition. > I feel very strongly – and you are most welcome to agree, disagree or > otherwise feed back – that the appearance of SSRIs such as Prozac and other > such ‘upper downers’ (my term, I even wrote a song about it;) > are the establishment response to the challenge of the restlessness of the > middle class white population in the wake of the societal upheavals of the > late 60s and early 70s. Look at it this way (and this is highly theoretical, > if a little too credible to dismiss): In the late 60s and early 70s the > unrest in the West, esp. in the West, amongst the white middle class – which > was unprecedented in its style and content – must have been very concerning > to the control structure. They had already started dealing with some success > with the problems of > ethnic minority rebellion by running hard, highly addictive drugs into inner > city areas, etc (this is now a matter of record) thus turning the rebellious > energy in on itself. But what to do with the more ‘important’ middle class > strata of society, who were also showing signs of discontent and unease? > The control structure realised that different rules had to apply for this > latter group. Hence the arising of a new kind of addictive and, if anything, > even more insidious kind of drug. A kind of drug that would desensitise, > render more submissive, and crucially undermine spiritual aspects of the > human being (which are causal in the kind of unrest seen as necessary to > suppress) whilst leaving most users able to function as needed for society > at large to continue to endorse and support the control structure. Eureka! > SSRIs! Prozac!! Cipramil!! Zispin!! Miracle drugs (sic) to treat > ‘depression’ which is in any case often just a nautral process of spiritual > awakening where the initial symptoms of a change of awareness and > consciousness – the coming to awareness first of the negative energy forms – > that would eventually, if treated intelligently, give way to new growth in > the mind, body and spirit, are instead hammered ruthlessly into clinical > negatives. > Is this mad raving? Conspiracy theory?? I doubt it. As a sufferer for a > quarter century from bipolarity I am not ‘blaming anybody’ and I am realist. > All I am saying is that it seems a little uncanny that all these Prozac > drugs and their boosters appeared when they did. This is a form of spiritual > warfare we’re seeing, and it is intensifying. The economic battle is won. > Now the battle for our souls has begun. Literally. Even TV, MTV, video > games, movies, and all the other paraphenalia of distraction has not been > enough to > deter awakening awareness at this time. The ‘drugs’ are the best hope ‘they’ > have of making ‘us’ them. > Comments welcome…and thanx for a magnificent resource and > support…Cybermystic

Response:

Smell the fart.

Response:

Way past China’s Shore.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Steps" >Smell the fart. > Clear across the Sea?? > — > "Caution, the surgeon general has found that psychiatric > treatements cause poverty and mental illness."

Response:

Question:

http://www.sciencenews.org New antidepressant medications have gained widespread use in the past decade, and more await approval from the Food and Drug Administration following clinical trials. Much debate currently concerns whether it’s ethical for physicians to give placebo pills to depressed volunteers in such studies, instead of providing either the drug being tested or an FDA-approved antidepressant. An analysis of the FDA’s clinical-trial database on recently approved antidepressants now promises to enliven the controversy further. It finds that depressed patients assigned to 4 to 8 weeks of placebo treatment

Question:

>All this "science", and one still has to play hit or >miss with meds. Welcome to the real world. >Science is an attempt to understand and >control >the world, and the mind; looking for the inner >thetan or counting chicken bones, has not >been >competitive. >Squiggles

"The purpose of "Science" is to devolop without prejudice or preconception of any kind a knowledge of the facts, the laws and the processes of nature. The laws of nature are the rules of existence, actions and relations, where God has endowed animate and inanimate matter by giving it various properties, as essential to its varing constitution and as regulating its existence, actions and relations. It is erroneous in this imperfect earth and universe to speak of fixed and eternally unchngeable laws of nature." Paul S. L. Johnson (1938)

Response:

> >You allow yourself to fear death! > What’s wrong with embracing death?

– We are not so powerful as to embrace death; sometimes it embraces us. Squiggles

Response:

> >> Is the mind even meant to be "controlled"? >Absolutely – unless you like running around like >a raving lunatic, and slaughtering millions of >innocent people, like some great charismatic leaders >have done – I think you can name them. > Actually, people with their mind controlled do slaughter innocent > people. See religion.

If you mean "drugged" by controlled, which is what you originally used the word for in the previous message, undrugged insanity is more dangerous than drugged insanity. Squiggles

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > wrote the following: >>> Is the mind even meant to be "controlled"? >>Absolutely – unless you like running around like >>a raving lunatic, and slaughtering millions of >>innocent people, like some great charismatic leaders >>have done – I think you can name them. > Actually, people with their mind controlled do slaughter innocent > people. See religion. > This mailbomber guy had some issues: > Text of note left with bombs in Illinois, Iowa > Following is the letter attached to pipe bombs left in mailboxes in > Iowa and Illinois. Spelling and punctuation errors are preserved from > the original: > Mailboxes are exploding! Why, you ask? > Attention people. > You do things because you can and want (desire) to > If the government controls what you want to do, they control what you > can do. > If you are under the impression that death exists, and you fear it, you > do anything to avoid it. (This is the same way pain operates. Naturally > we strive to avoid negative emotion/pain.) > You allow yourself to fear death! > World authorities allowed, and still allow you to fear death! > In avoiding death you are forced to conform, if you fail to conform, > you suffer mentally and physically. (Are world powers utilizing the > natural survival instinct in a way that allows them to capitalize on > the people?) > To ?live? (avoid death) in this society you are forced to conform/slave > away. > I?m here to help you realize/ understand that you will live no matter > what! It is up to you people to open your hearts and minds. There is no > such thing as death. The people I?ve dismissed from this reality are > not at all dead. > Conforming to the boundaries, and restrictions imposed by the > government only reduces the substance in your lives. When 1% of the > nation controls 99% of the nations total wealth, is it a wonder why > there are control problems? > The United States strives to provide freedom for their people. Do we > really have personal freedom? I?ve lived here for many years, and I see > much limitation. Does the definition of freedom include limitation? > I?ve learned about the history of various civilizations in history, and > I see more and more limitation. Do you people enjoy this trend of > limitation? If not, change it! > As long as you are uninformed about death you will continue to say ?how > high?, when the government tells you to ?jump?. As long as the > government is uninformed about death they will continue tell you to > ?jump? Is the government uninformed about death, or are they > pretending? > You have been missing how things are, for very long. I?m obtaining your > attention in the only way I can. More info is on its way. More > ?attention getters? are on the way. If I could, I would change only one > person, unfortunately the resources are not accessible. It seems > killing a single famous person would get the same media attention as > killing numerous un-famous humans. There is less risk of being > detained, associated with dismissing certain people. > Sincerely, > Someone Who Cares > PS. More info. will be delivered to various locations around the > country. > — >

Question:

>However the bad thing is that the cogentin is extremely sedating >and makes me get out of breath faster,

So much for wanking it at porn sites.

Response:

>Who has heard of adding anti-cholinergics like Cogentin to their SSRIs to get >them to activate decently again?

You’re the usenut Pdoc – tell us!

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Ive been taking the anti-parkinsons/EPS drug Cogentin for the past week. I find > its quite sedating. It has gotten rid of all tight muscle related problems Ive > been having. I didnt like it until today. Today I realized suddenly, > unexpectely I began getting that old familiar "SSRI activation" real strongly. > Like when my SSRIs used to activate good. Took me by total surprise. Starting > to get nausea too, like when SSRIs used to activate good for me and give me > nausea, akathisia, dizziness, anxiety, etc. the first two weeks. > Who has heard of adding anti-cholinergics like Cogentin to their SSRIs to get > them to activate decently again? I cant believe this, this has totally take me > by surprised. However the bad thing is that the cogentin is extremely sedating > and makes me get out of breath faster, even though I feel relaxed.

It’s a double miracle!! First the dreaded anti-cholinergics make Eric feel better, then he recovers enough from his depression that he does not need ECT. Praise the lord, you better tithe 20% of whatever salary this miracle the lord has wrought enables you to make, Eric.  How about that, huh the lord surely do act in strange and mysterious ways, huh?

Response:

>First the dreaded anti-cholinergics make Eric feel better, then he recovers >enough from his depression that he does not need ECT.

Gee – I see you were as surprised as myself. Cogentin is the answer!

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Thanks Peter, I actually dont have that many side effects  with the ACE. Its > kind of hard to describe, its  just that the ACE interferes with the Luvox. I > seriously doubt Id have any better luck with another blood pressure pill. Its a > hard to explain problem. I think what I am going to have to do is add some low > dose atypial anti-psychotic to get the SSRI fully activated, then perhaps throw > in an anticonvulsant on top of it all to help get rid of the "numbess."

Response:

YEAAAAAAAAA!! i am rejoicing with you!! cal

Response:

>Zoloft. Stopped taking the Cogentin cause it was revving my BP up, guess it was >those anti-cholinergic side effects.

BP no doubt meaning Bipolar after the manic posting of wav files. Is the shock jock still on? Why waste 3 years talking about it – you could have had relief 3 years ago! Attention seeker?

Response:

Question:

Can anyone tell me about lithium augmentation with SSRIs or SNRIs or whatever?  I’m taking 225mg Effexor XR and my doctor has suggested using lithium augmentation to help with some of the more resistant symptoms.  I’ve tried a whole bunch of other stuff (mostly SSRIs), but I’m a little worried about trying lithium because of it’s reputation as a "hard" drug. Please let me know about any of the positive/negative aspects of lithium, as well as side effects, etc. Anything at all would be appreciated. Elsa

Response:

> Can anyone tell me about lithium augmentation with SSRIs or SNRIs or > whatever?  I’m taking 225mg Effexor XR and my doctor has suggested > using lithium augmentation to help with some of the more resistant > symptoms.  I’ve tried a whole bunch of other stuff (mostly SSRIs), but > I’m a little worried about trying lithium because of it’s reputation > as a "hard" drug. Please let me know about any of the > positive/negative aspects of lithium, as well as side effects, etc. > Anything at all would be appreciated. > Elsa

Hi Elsa, I know that lithium is used as an adjunct drug with other meds, though off hand, I cannot tell you which; and it’s important to know that there is not bad interaction and to know the dose, etc.  Please excuse me for this rough reply; I am presently going through a drug experience myself, but I am attaching a site you may find useful with many links on lithium info. As for lithium being a "hard drug" – I am not sure what you mean by this.  It is the gold standard for bipolar depression. take care Squiggles http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Lithium/

Response:

Welcome to the ng, Here is some info: > Can anyone tell me about lithium augmentation with SSRIs or SNRIs or > whatever?  I’m taking 225mg Effexor XR and my doctor has suggested > using lithium augmentation to help with some of the more resistant > symptoms.  I’ve tried a whole bunch of other stuff (mostly SSRIs), but > I’m a little worried about trying lithium because of it’s reputation > as a "hard" drug. Please let me know about any of the > positive/negative aspects of lithium, as well as side effects, etc. > Anything at all would be appreciated.

http://www.biopsychiatry.com/lithaug.htm Lithium augmentation in treatment-resistant depression: meta-analysis of placebo-controlled studies by Bauer M, Dopfmer S Department of Psychiatry, Klinikum Benjamin Franklin, Freie Unversitat Berlin, Germany. J Clin Psychopharmacol 1999 Oct; 19(5):427-34 ABSTRACT The addition of lithium to the treatment regimens of previously nonresponding depressed patients has been repeatedly investigated in controlled studies. The authors undertook this meta-analysis to investigate the efficacy of lithium augmentation of conventional antidepressants. An attempt was made to identify all placebo-controlled trials of lithium augmentation in refractory depression. Only double-blind studies that involved participants who had been treated with lithium or placebo addition after not responding to conventional antidepressants were to be included in the meta-analysis. Further inclusion criteria were the use of accepted diagnostic criteria for depression and the use of response criteria based on the acceptable measurement of depression as an outcome variable. Studies were located by a search of the MEDLINE database, a search in the Cochrane Library, and an intensive search by hand of reviews on lithium augmentation. Nine of 11 placebo-controlled, double-blind studies were included in this meta-analysis. Aggregating three studies with a total of 110 patients that used a minimum lithium dose of 800 mg/day, or a dose sufficient to reach lithium serum levels of > or = 0.5 mEq/L, and a minimum treatment duration of 2 weeks, the authors found that the pooled odds ratio of response during lithium augmentation compared with the response during placebo treatment was 3.31 (95% confidence interval, 1.46-7.53). The corresponding relative response rate was 2.14 (95% confidence interval, 1.23-3.70), the absolute improvement in response rate was 27% (95% confidence interval, 9.8%-44.2%), and the number of patients needed to be treated to obtain one more responder was 3.7. Inclusion of six more studies that fulfilled inclusion criteria but which treated subjects with additional lithium for less than 2 weeks or with a lower lithium dose (total, 234 patients) resulted in even higher estimates. Lithium augmentation seems to be the treatment strategy in refractory depression that has been investigated most frequently in placebo-controlled, double-blind studies. The authors conclude from this meta-analysis that with respect to efficacy, lithium augmentation is the first-choice treatment procedure for depressed patients who fail to respond to http://bipolar.about.com/library/weekly/mpreviss.htm Go to site and select from the following: 04/02/01 – Lithium: The First Mood Stabilizer Part 4: Whoa, Fat! We conclude our look at Lithium be examining the possible reasons why so many people gain weight – sometimes a LOT of weight – while taking it. 03/26/01 – Lithium: The First Mood Stabilizer Part 3: Major Precautions and Warnings Important facts about this medication, including salt intake, pre-existing conditions, interactions with other medications and other issues.. 03/19/01 – Lithium: The First Mood Stabilizer Part 2: Tests and Toxicity Tests have to be run before starting lithium therapy to make sure it is safe and appropriate for the patient. More tests have to be done throughout the course of therapy to make sure blood levels are within the safe and effective range, because lithium overdose can be very dangerous. 03/12/01 – Lithium: The First Mood Stabilizer Part 1: History, and a Mystery Solved It took nearly 50 years for scientists to start figuring out how lithium works. In Part 1 of a four-part series, we look at the history of lithium and the ground-breaking research that unlocked its mysteries. antidepressant monotherapy.

Response:

<snip> I’ve used lithium as an augmenting agent, and I must say that I really liked it. It did help my anti-depressant, and it very nicely leveled out the worst of my rapid mood swings from depressed but coping to desperately self-destructive. Did have a couple drawbacks though. I had a persistent hand tremor, usually annoying but tolerable though sometimes bad enough to make handwriting difficult and handling coins a disaster. Ultimately, I had to go off lithium because it was reducing my thyroid function too much. A couple months of thyroid supplements took care of that problem. Bright blessings. Fiona — If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not sometimes taste the adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome.      – Anne Bradstreet, Meditations Divine and Moral, 1664

Response:

Question:

Though suffering some degree of depression,  most of my life I managed to develop friendships were generally positive, supportive and beneficial. In recent years, this hasn’t been the case.  Suddenly, these negative, critical, non-supportive type people been calling or attempting to foist sick relationships on me. I am wondering what I used to do so right…I managed to avoid these types of people for so long! I see, my goals and activities used to be wholly positive.  In HS, my goal was to go to college, so my activities were towards that end,  academic study, extra curricula activities, and a job worked to earn money to save to pay for college. In college, goal was similiar, finish collge, go to grad school, so my activities were academic study, EC of an academic nature, while working to pay all my expenses.  Friends during all those years..were people possessed of similiar goals engaged in similiar activities.. As a young profesional, I continued going to school for degrees, and then doing that which was required to obtain professional credentials. Eventually I got all the degrees and credentials I wanted, and  turned my sights to seeing the world…joining ski clubs, and scuba diving clubs  so the cost of my doing so wasnt too prohibitive. Friends and acquaitances again be made amongst those with similiar goals..engaged in similiarly POSITIVE activities. I graduated HS in 74,  and went to college and grad school in the late ’70’s, a time where the drug culture was such it swarmed all about me.  I was too busy with studies and work,  to have any involvement with people getting high, everywhere…I looked.. Their mommy and daddy’s were footing the bill for their college expenses, they could afford such,  I couldnt. ..besides I preferred to take the bus over to the Gym,  and swim laps and spend some time in the sauna…in my free time, that was my high,  rather than whatever everyone round me was getting high on. Shortly before I turned 18, the drinking age was lowered to 18, owing to cries 18 yearolds were sent to war, ought to be able to have a drink. So by sophomore year..they installed a compus PUB! I go, but was so antsy while there, I have a glass of wine..with friends..and be on my way…even when it be Rick Springstein or Renaissance playing…I was too busy.the Pub was always so smoky..and everyone in it was so  DRUNK and or HIGH! During my professional years, between memberships in Y’s and ski clubs,and scuba clubs..swimming, sking..and scubadiving were my past times.. so once again my involvements were with people doing those things.. and only occaisionally would coworkers get me to join them for a drink after work…But like in college…I get antsy in a bar…have a drink with them and be on my way. I never known a drunk or a drug addict  while they were a drunk or a drug addict.  In recent years, though I been found appealing by ex drunks and drug addicts.. Why…all the sudden do I find myself being sought out by such people..trying to involve me in relationships with them.. And, I think it has something to do with  my antidepressant use..and all it really did to me…insidiously…without me knowing…or understanding,  or recognizing it…something supposed to have helped me…in reality turned me into a damn junkie. I took the first SSRI, prozac  and all the others  to ENABLE me to cope better with difficult circumstances and help me manage my life. Unfortunately, it did the opposite… while inciting thoughts along the lines…of don’t worry, be happy,  don’t give all you worked for the previous 20 years,  educationally and professionally any thought at all, becoming the  world series of poker champion is the a much more worthy calling, anyway  and you are your own boss, can make your own hours…call the shots…much more conducing to single parenting! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL So what if you losing contact with good friends..cause they dont know you any more,  and your relationships among people are becoming increasingly amongst those you never have a thing to do with before you were prozaced, or zolofted, or paxilated, or wellbetroned, or serzoned.. to their being drunk, or high on their  crystal meth, or their cocaine or their poison of choice.. So what if all your previous motivation to do positive, and worthy things in the crapper on Paxil…and you are going down the tubes…on the way to the dump heap…trash bin…the gutter… Just take that Paxil..and you wont feel the pain…on your way down, down, down… At least until you hit your bottom…and go SPLAT! And think,  what the heck….  how did this happen.. and come to a NG…where everyone is in friggen denial bout what prozac, paxil, zoloft, and WB, and serzone really doing to them…making them junkies… NO SSRI anonymous  for paxil junkies… no place to turn to when noone admits you been medicating into junkiehood… That when you stop paxil  the next 18 months…is in reality…recovery from a drug addiction with all up and downs and mood swings…involved in learning to deal with your feelings again after 10 years of having them blunted by meds..  etc etc.. All and totally and completely ALONE  with the knowledge..you are attempting to recover from being a SSRI junkie, addict…user… Cause it being addictive…and causing drug dependence and making a junkie of you…is DEnied, denied denied…. while your mental lonliness.. is so unimaginable  in a world chooses to deny and ignore the reality that those 85 million prescriptions for SSRIS  are prescriptions for junkiedom for those 85 million people. It’s truly a lonely road them want to get off SSRI’s are on…all by themselves…with the knowledge they are junkies having to kick an addiction not recognized as an addiction. .

Response:

> while your mental lonliness.. is so unimaginable  in a world chooses to deny > and ignore the reality that those 85 million prescriptions for SSRIS  are > prescriptions for junkiedom for those 85 million people. > It’s truly a lonely road them want to get off SSRI’s are on…all by > themselves…with the knowledge they are junkies having to kick an addiction > not recognized as an addiction.

Thank you for the trip down memory lane, it was enjoyable. So, you come to a depression support group, which has a major emphasis on medications, and tell people the very medications that have helped them return to normal, partial recovery, or have even saved their lives in cases that they are junkies? As the saying goes, with friends like you…

Response:

> Though suffering some degree of depression,  most of my life I managed to > develop friendships were generally positive, supportive and beneficial.

Whether or not your theory is correct is unimportant, IMHO. What steps are you taking, what decisions are you making, what choices do you recognize, to leave this all behind?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> while your mental lonliness.. is so unimaginable  in a world chooses to deny > and ignore the reality that those 85 million prescriptions for SSRIS are > prescriptions for junkiedom for those 85 million people. > It’s truly a lonely road them want to get off SSRI’s are on…all by > themselves…with the knowledge they are junkies having to kick an addiction > not recognized as an addiction. > Thank you for the trip down memory lane, it was enjoyable. > So, you come to a depression support group, which has a major emphasis > on medications, and tell people the very medications that have helped > them return to normal, partial recovery, or have even saved their lives > in cases that they are junkies? > As the saying goes, with friends like you…

Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you present.. IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with news and research results in these areas.. Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal ..be that a positive or negative experience. just my 2c regards, Bob

Response:

> Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you present.. > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with news > and research results in these areas.. > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal ..be > that a positive or negative experience. > just my 2c > regards, > Bob

Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > and research results in these areas.. > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > that a positive or negative experience. > just my 2c > regards, > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched.

Bob, Junkies? That only serves to inflame. As for news and discussion, I think we can have that without SSRI users being referred to as junkies. Her _only_ intent was to inflame, but defend her if you must. Individual experiences true, but not the highly inflammatory 85 million junkies. — I hate to say it but I personally believe some of the ideas for prescribing neuroleptics for aggression in non-psychotic cases stems from the huge influx of jews in psychiatry.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > and research results in these areas.. > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > that a positive or negative experience. > just my 2c > regards, > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched.

At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order regardless of diagnosis. In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as manic can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and become more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely shells.. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > > and research results in these areas.. > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > > that a positive or negative experience. > > just my 2c > > regards, > > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > Bob, Junkies? That only serves to inflame.

I suppose it does if you extract and highlight the word from a long and thoughtful piece about the lonely plight of people suffering from "discontinuation syndrome". there is no longer much doubt that many people have been needlessly put into a state of harmful drug dependency and its only fairly recently that their situation has been acknowledged.. > As for news and discussion, I think we can have that without SSRI users > being referred to as junkies.

In an ideal world perhaps :>) had you had the experience and suffered the damage (BTW that you persist in mockingly dismissing as drunkeness) you too might be quite bitter about it..She speaks as an insider and a longtime SSRI user. Her _only_ intent was to inflame, IMO your personal antipathy and eagerness to align yourself with her enemies sways your judgement. you are mindreading as Ralph calls it.  but > defend her if you must.

Im suprised you havent noticed that I *havent* been doing such.. Its a rather important principle Im defending here.. That a truth shouldnt be stifled because the loudest voices find it unpalateable > Individual experiences true, but not the highly inflammatory 85 million > junkies.

I think you will find that the statement was that the 85 million prescriptions were potential roads to junkiedom. Its a bit disingenuous to suggest that a victims wish to prevent future victims.. is in some fashion insulting the victims.. If you came off your Jihad long enough to actually listen and understand..rather than scan text for juicy ammunition in your flamewar you might be a bit more compassionate.. "Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster.And when you look in the abyss, the abyss also looks into you." Friedrich Nietzche – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> — > I hate to say it but I personally believe some of the ideas for > prescribing neuroleptics for aggression in non-psychotic cases stems > from the huge influx of jews in psychiatry.

Response:

I think it is a degre to the suffering, when C’ella (Cruella?) is her sickest (imho) she goes on these rampages. Wasn’t Lynda on her kill file?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > > and research results in these areas.. > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because > of > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > > that a positive or negative experience. > > just my 2c > > regards, > > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who > trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order > regardless of diagnosis. > In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as manic > can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and become > more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who > just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely > shells..

Response:

> I think it is a degre to the suffering, when C’ella (Cruella?) is her > sickest (imho) she goes on these rampages. Wasn’t Lynda on her kill file?

Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. Ill happily discuss the issues. You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in isolation. smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and personal attacks.. Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal redress is no substitute for support. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > > present.. > > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > > news > > > and research results in these areas.. > > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence > because > of > > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > > ..be > > > that a positive or negative experience. > > > just my 2c > > > regards, > > > Bob > > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who > trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order > regardless of diagnosis. > In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as manic > can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and > become > more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who > just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely > shells..

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. >Ill happily discuss the issues. >You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more >interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in >isolation. >smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and >personal attacks.. >Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal >redress is no substitute for support. > Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog as > he does.

I think he just supports Linda C right or wrong.. Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it.

I know.. It gets so that us discussing or arguing about meds and their effects seems like a sideshow… or interuption to the personal abuse.. and there is no shame in saying if you are depressed you just cant cope with it.. there was a lot of good stuff you posted that I wanted to respond to from my POV  but you have to kind of pluck it out from the garbage personal abuse.. BTW what was the result with the new meds and that ? regards, Bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I think it is a degre to the suffering, when C’ella (Cruella?) is her > sickest (imho) she goes on these rampages. Wasn’t Lynda on her kill file? > Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. > Ill happily discuss the issues. > You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more > interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in > isolation. > smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and > personal attacks.. > Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal > redress is no substitute for support. > > > > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > > > present.. > > > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete > with > > > news > > > > and research results in these areas.. > > > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence > because > > of > > > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are > universal > > > ..be > > > > that a positive or negative experience. > > > > just my 2c > > > > regards, > > > > Bob > > > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > > At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who > > trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order > > regardless of diagnosis. > > In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as > manic > > can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and > become > > more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who > > just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely > > shells..

Response:

Don’t read em Eric, btw if you haven’t noticed I left the slice alone until _she_ attacked my friend. You do understand the concept of friendship don’t you Eric? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. >Ill happily discuss the issues. >You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more >interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in >isolation. >smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and >personal attacks.. >Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal >redress is no substitute for support. > Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog as > he does. Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it. > Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

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> >BTW what was the result with the new meds and that ? > New med?

you were concerned you were going to go psychotic or something and took a break.. you said you were trying something new ? maybe I have got it wrong.. to do with your physical problems? regards, Bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

Response:

That’s such bullshit Bob you fucking love the wars, your right there in the middle of all this pointing fingers naming names, "H" worrd inserted here.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. > >Ill happily discuss the issues. > >You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are > more > >interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" > in > >isolation. > >smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and > >personal attacks.. > >Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal > >redress is no substitute for support. > Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I > dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog > as > he does. > I think he just supports Linda C right or wrong.. > Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda > Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it. > I know.. > It gets so that us discussing or arguing about meds and their effects seems > like a sideshow… or interuption to the personal abuse.. > and there is no shame in saying if you are depressed you just cant cope with > it.. > there was a lot of good stuff you posted that I wanted to respond to from my > POV  but you have to kind of pluck it out from the garbage personal abuse.. > BTW what was the result with the new meds and that ? > regards, > Bob > Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

Response:

Don’t worry about it, Robert. Bob conveniently overlooks that this thread was started as nothing more than an attack, out of the blue, by one of his protected flock. > You are in no position to call others cruel

Well, I am, Bob. And she is. I won’t bore you with quotes, because you’ll ignore them anyway.

Response:

Oh well ..back to the alice in wonderland logic where stating clearly that I will discuss the issues  but not the personalities proves Im flaming.. sigh.. > Don’t worry about it, Robert. Bob conveniently overlooks that this thread > was started as nothing more than an attack, out of the blue, by one of his > protected flock.

The title of the thread states fairly succintly what the piece is about.. and it actually summarises the experience of many sufferers particularly but not only.. long term Paxil users . An ABC medical journalist recently said pretty much the same.. In an email group Im in ..no less than four separate people tonight talked of how they and their relatives concerns were dismissed as imaginary or symptomatic of the ilness treated rather than the effect of the Paxil withdrawal that it later turned out to be.. Ill say the same to you as I said to Robert ..Im quite happy to discuss the issues which are important ones for many ..but Im not getting involved with your personality clashes.. Its ultimately pretty boring .. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > You are in no position to call others cruel > Well, I am, Bob. And she is. I won’t bore you with quotes, because you’ll > ignore them anyway.

Response:

> Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog as > he does. Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it.

Maybe if she’d stop bashing his illness, yet rambling wild off topic herself. Just a thought. If so many people are flaming Linda, did you ever think it might be her? — I think to myself, "you stupid fuck nigger, you are in the USA and not Ghana or West Afrika. Why dont you wear the requisite clothing?

Response:

>had you had the experience and suffered the damage (BTW that you persist in >mockingly dismissing as drunkeness) you too might be quite bitter about >it..She speaks as an insider and a longtime SSRI user. > Bob, I was offended. > If she wants to debate me on the merits, fine.

well I wish you or someone would instead of simply following mojos call to a personal flame war..  Calling everyone an > addict,

She didnt call everyone an addict at all thats a travesty of what she said..deliberately invoked to continue a pattern of personal attacks then poking fun at the meds that Fiona took for bipolar > crosses the line, period.

Fiona has said equally off-colour things to her.. things to her.. and no-one said a word about it .. as I read it it was a tongue in cheek reference to the meds inciting the grandiosity she was accused of.. Quickly and skilfully picked up on by "Mojo" whose only purpose here is to attack Linda and Eric.. > I have been an addict, and to compare that to SSRI usage is a joke, no > ifs, ands, or buts.

Well I have too and ..of itself ..heroin addiction does arguably much less harm..and to massively fewer numbers.. I realise addiction conjures up pictures of people scouring alleys to mug old ladies and people rolling about smoking crack cocaine but actually far more doctors and nurses are addicts than you might imagine and outwardly live quite respectable and unremarkable lives.. People in vast numbers are being given drugs that are quite innapropriate and find they are unable to come off them . Discontinuation syndrome is a more neutral term but many like the Paxil lawer feel its simply a word game.. If you cant function as a human being without a supply of a drug what would you call it? And this fate because you went to a GP complaining of shyness for example!! and he/she didnt inform of this because they didnt know themselves because all thr information comes from the drug company.. thats what makes people like me angry.. IMO thats the issue not petty bickering and personality clashes.. or who can be in whose gang.. regards, Bob > Sharon > He who fears he shall suffer, already suffers what he fears. – Michel de

Montaigne

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> x-no-archive:yes

And forgeting to mention and I’m sure you’ll bring it up. Well I didnt :>) > Yes, I will challenge her mental status when she does that to me, or > BP’s in General. I will challenge her on her meds, when she does that. > If it’s good enough for her, surely you’ll support me.

Whats sauce for the goose is certainly sauce for the gander and  its another smear and travesty the suggestion that I support Linda in whatever she says ..put about by the very people who asked me to befriend her as a matter of fact.. If you look at what i have *actually* said as opposed to what certain people have implied I have said… you will notice I havent actually got involved at all.. Linda not only is quite capable of speaking for herself but actively dislikes her friends sticking up for her.. Maybe its because Im an aquarian but I tend to support ideas and principles more than the people making them as far as arguments go.. I know Bush has made it all the rage in America but Im not very keen on this "if your not with me your against me" business.. a long response again and possibly all I have to say on the matter.. Now I must sleep but I thought you deserved a considered answer as you seemed quite genuine .. regards, Bob > Sharon > He who fears he shall suffer, already suffers what he fears. – Michel de

Montaigne

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Question:

I have been on Celexa now since November 15, 2001, and started at 10 mg and slowly increased my dose.  I am now up to 40 mg, which I take at bedtime.  Even though the Celexa is supposed to help with depression, I have noticed that I have been crying more since I have been on the Celexa.  I thought that for a while the Celexa was working, however, I am beginning to think it isn’t working since I have experienced a lot more crying lately. Has anyone had any similar experiences while taking Celexa? Thanks. Joey

Response:

> Has anyone had any similar experiences while taking Celexa?

Yes, I had a similar experience to yours.  Celexa seemed to help me for a short while (couple of months or so) and then it seemed not to have any effect (positive or negative) after that.  I started out on 40mg a day and was on 60mg a day when my pdoc switched me to Paxil and Seroquel.  I weigh in at about 275 right now to give you somewhat of an idea of why my doses were what they were.

Response:

I have had the same experience with all SSRIs. I cry constantly, hallucinate, feel paranoid and totally detached from my body. I tried to take Elavil again and had the same problem, so after 10 years of trying meds, I give up. There has to be another way for those of us who can’t tolerate meds.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I have been on Celexa now since November 15, 2001, and started at 10 > mg and slowly increased my dose.  I am now up to 40 mg, which I take > at bedtime.  Even though the Celexa is supposed to help with > depression, I have noticed that I have been crying more since I have > been on the Celexa.  I thought that for a while the Celexa was > working, however, I am beginning to think it isn’t working since I > have experienced a lot more crying lately. > Has anyone had any similar experiences while taking Celexa? > Thanks. > Joey

Response:

> I have been on Celexa now since November 15, 2001, and started at 10 > mg and slowly increased my dose.  I am now up to 40 mg, which I take > at bedtime.  Even though the Celexa is supposed to help with > depression, I have noticed that I have been crying more since I have > been on the Celexa.  I thought that for a while the Celexa was > working, however, I am beginning to think it isn’t working since I > have experienced a lot more crying lately. > Has anyone had any similar experiences while taking Celexa? > Thanks. > Joey

crying isn’t necessarily a good indicator of depression. when i’m deeply depressed, i don’t cry; i’m much too numb. for me, at least, crying is often a sign of recovery. -lisa

Response:

It just made me numb most of the time. I did cry occasionally just becuase it didn’t matter if I cried or not. I’m just trying to get on without which is proberbly a bad idea but I prefer to feel depressed than not to feel …Groundhog

Response:

I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who are on that dose and how you are doing? Thanks, Joey

Response:

I’m taking Celexa 20mg since one month.  I fell better with this med than Paxil and Effexor. I take my med morning.  I have no inconvenient with this. Aline – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions > for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started > me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first > started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor > suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, > take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in > the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but > because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which > have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, > would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as > compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit > more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. > Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 > mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who > are on that dose and how you are doing?

I’m up to 60 mg, going 10 mg at a time.  At 20 mg, I didn’t notice anything.  At 40mg, I noticed a little less depression but no help for my anxiety.  The doctor thought that 40 helping with the depression was good news to we went to 60 to see if it would help the anxiety. So far, the only negative side effect I’ve experienced is dry mouth. — David Chamberlain http://www.dslnorthwest.net/~dchamberlain — Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if you stop opening presents and listen. — A 9/11 Tribute — http://www.politicsandprotest.org/

Response:

my doc had me all the way up to 80,  and i have read after 40 there really isnt much more it can do but i could be wrong, but i had no side effects or relief at that matter. brian s. — Get 5 bucks free for signing up with the internets #1 e-payment service. https://www.paypal.com/refer/pal=8YXF6QPBZH46C Check out my tape trading list below. .shtml

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions > for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started > me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first > started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor > suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, > take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in > the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but > because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which > have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, > would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as > compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit > more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. > Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 > mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who > are on that dose and how you are doing? > I’m up to 60 mg, going 10 mg at a time.  At 20 mg, I didn’t notice > anything.  At 40mg, I noticed a little less depression but no help for > my anxiety.  The doctor thought that 40 helping with the depression was > good news to we went to 60 to see if it would help the anxiety. > So far, the only negative side effect I’ve experienced is dry mouth. > — > David Chamberlain > http://www.dslnorthwest.net/~dchamberlain > — > Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if you stop opening > presents and listen. > — > A 9/11 Tribute — http://www.politicsandprotest.org/

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey

Joey, I also just started on Celexa. I was using Effexor. The effexor was not working as well any longer and I wanted a change. My pdoc changed me to the Celexa. I’ve been taking it about 3 weeks now. I was very depressed 3 weeks ago. In fact attempted suicide. I didn’t think I’d ever feel better up until about 2 days ago. The medication is starting to kick in and I’m feeling much better. I’m on 30 mg and am grateful that I feel better. There have been many times in my life that I have questioned the "do I want to be on meds?" question. My answer is simple but complex. I want to be able to be "normal" but you know for me that’s not going to happen. It is a sadnes that I grieve over but have come to accept to some degree. I think that this is your question. Am I right? Well, I needed to determine the kind of like I wanted to live and with my depression/panic disorder/ptsd well I don’t function well without medications. So, I decided that rather than feel totally destroyed I take the medications, go to therapy and do the best I can. Your experience may or may not be the same. You have to decide what is right for you. mouse

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I’m up to 60 mg, going 10 mg at a time.  At 20 mg, I didn’t notice >anything.  At 40mg, I noticed a little less depression but no help for >my anxiety.  The doctor thought that 40 helping with the depression was >good news to we went to 60 to see if it would help the anxiety. >So far, the only negative side effect I’ve experienced is dry mouth. >– >David Chamberlain >http://www.dslnorthwest.net/~dchamberlain >– >Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if you stop opening >presents and listen. >– >A 9/11 Tribute — http://www.politicsandprotest.org/

One of my problems is distinguishing between the depression and the anxiety.  Also, when you have been depressed for so long, it is sometimes hard to know what normal is when you have gotten used to the depression.  A good way of explaining this, especially in my case, is that prior to being treated for depression, I had five brain surgeries due to hydrocephalus and an arachnoid cyst on my optic nerve.  The symptoms that I was experiencing as a result of these problems included siezures, headaches, and short-term memory loss with the headaches getting worse.  Well, at different times, I recall going to the doctor and telling him that I had no headaches and was doing fine. However, after the appointment I would tell my parents (This all got diagnosed when I was 17), that I had a headache and didn’t know why I told the doctor otherwise.  What was happening in my case was that as the headaches got worse, my tolerance level for pain got higher and higher, so what used to be a painful headache wasn’t as painful.  I think the same thing has happened with the depression and the anxiety. With the headaches, my doctor had me keep a headache journal to track when I had headaches and how long.  I have been keeping a journal since I have started counseling and started on medication, but I am still struggling with the anxiety and worry. Joey

Response:

Once you body is at a "steady state" with it it won’t make a lot of difference when you take the stuff. I’ll tell you what your shrink probably will: experiment a little and take it when it works best for you. I’ve found Celexa an effective medication but it is slower to work and doesn’t provide the same jolt as an increase in Zolft does, for instance. teh flip side is that Celexa doesn’t dampen my sex drive the way an equivalent dose of Zoloft did. It’s also slower to loose it’s effectiveness and require a dose adjustment. JCS

Response:

Once you body is at a "steady state" with it it won’t make a lot of difference when you take the stuff. I’ll tell you what your shrink probably will: experiment a little and take it when it works best for you. I’ve found Celexa an effective medication but it is slower to work and doesn’t provide the same jolt as an increase in Zolft does, for instance. teh flip side is that Celexa doesn’t dampen my sex drive the way an equivalent dose of Zoloft did. It’s also slower to loose it’s effectiveness and require a dose adjustment. JCS Newsgroups: tnn.test,alt.support.depression X-No-Archive: yes Lines: 2 NNTP-Posting-Host: wonenara.ozemail.com.au Organization: OzEmail Ltd, Australia Distribution: world Path: news.sol.net!spool0-nwblwi.newsops.execpc.com!newsfeeds.sol.net!priapus.vis i.com!zeus.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!hermes.visi.com!news1.optus.net.au!op tus!yorrell.saard.net!duster.adelaide.on.net!newsfeed.ozemail.com.au!ozemai l.com.au!not-for-mail This message was cancelled from within Mozilla.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey

From what my doctor has told me I don’t think it really matters whether you take Celexa in the morning or evening, as long as you take it regularly at the same time. As to your second question, I went from 20mg/day to 40/day and I found that the higher dose was no more effective than the lower dose and the higher dose made me too drowsy; after two months on the higher dosage I reverted to 20mg/day and have been quite happy since – I’ve been on the Celexa for about two years now.  However, different individuals react differently to each drug so the only sure way to find out how it will be with you is to try it. Best wishes, Peter.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey > From what my doctor has told me I don’t think it really matters > whether you take Celexa in the morning or evening, as long as you take > it regularly at the same time. > As to your second question, I went from 20mg/day to 40/day and I found > that the higher dose was no more effective than the lower dose and the > higher dose made me too drowsy; after two months on the higher dosage > I reverted to 20mg/day and have been quite happy since – I’ve been on > the Celexa for about two years now.  However, different individuals > react differently to each drug so the only sure way to find out how it > will be with you is to try it. > Best wishes, > Peter.

I was prescribed Celexa 8 weeks ago. It is making me feel better than I ever felt. I feel normal. I had been on Paxil for a year, felt worse. I’ve been on Zoloft, Serzone , Prozac, and none made me feel better till Celexor. I take it every night and feel no side effects and no drowsiness at all. I have recently lost my son. Nove 9th he died and I handled it pretty well even though I cry at times. I believe Celexor helped me through it. Peace Joanne

Response:

I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who are on that dose and how you are doing? Thanks, Joey

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I’m taking Celexa 20mg since one month.  I fell better with this med than Paxil and Effexor. I take my med morning.  I have no inconvenient with this. Aline – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions > for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started > me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first > started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor > suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, > take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in > the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but > because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which > have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, > would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as > compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit > more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. > Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 > mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who > are on that dose and how you are doing?

I’m up to 60 mg, going 10 mg at a time.  At 20 mg, I didn’t notice anything.  At 40mg, I noticed a little less depression but no help for my anxiety.  The doctor thought that 40 helping with the depression was good news to we went to 60 to see if it would help the anxiety. So far, the only negative side effect I’ve experienced is dry mouth. — David Chamberlain http://www.dslnorthwest.net/~dchamberlain — Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if you stop opening presents and listen. — A 9/11 Tribute — http://www.politicsandprotest.org/

Response:

my doc had me all the way up to 80,  and i have read after 40 there really isnt much more it can do but i could be wrong, but i had no side effects or relief at that matter. brian s. — Get 5 bucks free for signing up with the internets #1 e-payment service. https://www.paypal.com/refer/pal=8YXF6QPBZH46C Check out my tape trading list below. .shtml

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions > for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started > me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first > started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor > suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, > take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in > the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but > because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which > have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, > would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as > compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit > more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. > Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 > mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who > are on that dose and how you are doing? > I’m up to 60 mg, going 10 mg at a time.  At 20 mg, I didn’t notice > anything.  At 40mg, I noticed a little less depression but no help for > my anxiety.  The doctor thought that 40 helping with the depression was > good news to we went to 60 to see if it would help the anxiety. > So far, the only negative side effect I’ve experienced is dry mouth. > — > David Chamberlain > http://www.dslnorthwest.net/~dchamberlain > — > Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if you stop opening > presents and listen. > — > A 9/11 Tribute — http://www.politicsandprotest.org/

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey

Joey, I also just started on Celexa. I was using Effexor. The effexor was not working as well any longer and I wanted a change. My pdoc changed me to the Celexa. I’ve been taking it about 3 weeks now. I was very depressed 3 weeks ago. In fact attempted suicide. I didn’t think I’d ever feel better up until about 2 days ago. The medication is starting to kick in and I’m feeling much better. I’m on 30 mg and am grateful that I feel better. There have been many times in my life that I have questioned the "do I want to be on meds?" question. My answer is simple but complex. I want to be able to be "normal" but you know for me that’s not going to happen. It is a sadnes that I grieve over but have come to accept to some degree. I think that this is your question. Am I right? Well, I needed to determine the kind of like I wanted to live and with my depression/panic disorder/ptsd well I don’t function well without medications. So, I decided that rather than feel totally destroyed I take the medications, go to therapy and do the best I can. Your experience may or may not be the same. You have to decide what is right for you. mouse

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I’m up to 60 mg, going 10 mg at a time.  At 20 mg, I didn’t notice >anything.  At 40mg, I noticed a little less depression but no help for >my anxiety.  The doctor thought that 40 helping with the depression was >good news to we went to 60 to see if it would help the anxiety. >So far, the only negative side effect I’ve experienced is dry mouth. >– >David Chamberlain >http://www.dslnorthwest.net/~dchamberlain >– >Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if you stop opening >presents and listen. >– >A 9/11 Tribute — http://www.politicsandprotest.org/

One of my problems is distinguishing between the depression and the anxiety.  Also, when you have been depressed for so long, it is sometimes hard to know what normal is when you have gotten used to the depression.  A good way of explaining this, especially in my case, is that prior to being treated for depression, I had five brain surgeries due to hydrocephalus and an arachnoid cyst on my optic nerve.  The symptoms that I was experiencing as a result of these problems included siezures, headaches, and short-term memory loss with the headaches getting worse.  Well, at different times, I recall going to the doctor and telling him that I had no headaches and was doing fine. However, after the appointment I would tell my parents (This all got diagnosed when I was 17), that I had a headache and didn’t know why I told the doctor otherwise.  What was happening in my case was that as the headaches got worse, my tolerance level for pain got higher and higher, so what used to be a painful headache wasn’t as painful.  I think the same thing has happened with the depression and the anxiety. With the headaches, my doctor had me keep a headache journal to track when I had headaches and how long.  I have been keeping a journal since I have started counseling and started on medication, but I am still struggling with the anxiety and worry. Joey

Response:

i have been on Celexa for about a year. i take 20mg daily.  i take mine before bedtime because it makes me sleepy.  i haven’t had any undesirable side effects, however i have noticed that the longer i have been on it, i have had trouble with muscle aches.  does anyone else?

Response:

Once you body is at a "steady state" with it it won’t make a lot of difference when you take the stuff. I’ll tell you what your shrink probably will: experiment a little and take it when it works best for you. I’ve found Celexa an effective medication but it is slower to work and doesn’t provide the same jolt as an increase in Zolft does, for instance. teh flip side is that Celexa doesn’t dampen my sex drive the way an equivalent dose of Zoloft did. It’s also slower to loose it’s effectiveness and require a dose adjustment. JCS

Response:

Once you body is at a "steady state" with it it won’t make a lot of difference when you take the stuff. I’ll tell you what your shrink probably will: experiment a little and take it when it works best for you. I’ve found Celexa an effective medication but it is slower to work and doesn’t provide the same jolt as an increase in Zolft does, for instance. teh flip side is that Celexa doesn’t dampen my sex drive the way an equivalent dose of Zoloft did. It’s also slower to loose it’s effectiveness and require a dose adjustment. JCS Newsgroups: tnn.test,alt.support.depression X-No-Archive: yes Lines: 2 NNTP-Posting-Host: wonenara.ozemail.com.au Organization: OzEmail Ltd, Australia Distribution: world Path: news.sol.net!spool0-nwblwi.newsops.execpc.com!newsfeeds.sol.net!priapus.vis i.com!zeus.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!hermes.visi.com!news1.optus.net.au!op tus!yorrell.saard.net!duster.adelaide.on.net!newsfeed.ozemail.com.au!ozemai l.com.au!not-for-mail This message was cancelled from within Mozilla.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey

From what my doctor has told me I don’t think it really matters whether you take Celexa in the morning or evening, as long as you take it regularly at the same time. As to your second question, I went from 20mg/day to 40/day and I found that the higher dose was no more effective than the lower dose and the higher dose made me too drowsy; after two months on the higher dosage I reverted to 20mg/day and have been quite happy since – I’ve been on the Celexa for about two years now.  However, different individuals react differently to each drug so the only sure way to find out how it will be with you is to try it. Best wishes, Peter.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I have been on celexa now for four weeks now and have some questions >for those in this newsgroup who also take Celexa.  My doctor started >me out on 10 mg and then slowly increased me to 20 mg.  When I first >started on it, I started taking it in the morning like my doctor >suggested, although she said that if it causes too much drowsiness, >take it before bedtime.  Actually, I had to switch from taking it in >the morning to taking it at bedtime not because of drowsiness, but >because of some of the other minor, inconvenient side effects, which >have sense gone away.  Anyway, now that my body is used to the 20 mg, >would I benefit from taking the Celexa earlier on in the day as >compared to taking it at bedtime.  In other words, would I benefit >more from taking it in the morning rather than at bedtime. >Also, my doctor is having me increase my dose slowly from 20 mg to 40 >mg and I was wanting to know if there are any others in this group who >are on that dose and how you are doing? >Thanks, >Joey > From what my doctor has told me I don’t think it really matters > whether you take Celexa in the morning or evening, as long as you take > it regularly at the same time. > As to your second question, I went from 20mg/day to 40/day and I found > that the higher dose was no more effective than the lower dose and the > higher dose made me too drowsy; after two months on the higher dosage > I reverted to 20mg/day and have been quite happy since – I’ve been on > the Celexa for about two years now.  However, different individuals > react differently to each drug so the only sure way to find out how it > will be with you is to try it. > Best wishes, > Peter.

I was prescribed Celexa 8 weeks ago. It is making me feel better than I ever felt. I feel normal. I had been on Paxil for a year, felt worse. I’ve been on Zoloft, Serzone , Prozac, and none made me feel better till Celexor. I take it every night and feel no side effects and no drowsiness at all. I have recently lost my son. Nove 9th he died and I handled it pretty well even though I cry at times. I believe Celexor helped me through it. Peace Joanne

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