SSRIs

Question:

Though suffering some degree of depression,  most of my life I managed to develop friendships were generally positive, supportive and beneficial. In recent years, this hasn’t been the case.  Suddenly, these negative, critical, non-supportive type people been calling or attempting to foist sick relationships on me. I am wondering what I used to do so right…I managed to avoid these types of people for so long! I see, my goals and activities used to be wholly positive.  In HS, my goal was to go to college, so my activities were towards that end,  academic study, extra curricula activities, and a job worked to earn money to save to pay for college. In college, goal was similiar, finish collge, go to grad school, so my activities were academic study, EC of an academic nature, while working to pay all my expenses.  Friends during all those years..were people possessed of similiar goals engaged in similiar activities.. As a young profesional, I continued going to school for degrees, and then doing that which was required to obtain professional credentials. Eventually I got all the degrees and credentials I wanted, and  turned my sights to seeing the world…joining ski clubs, and scuba diving clubs  so the cost of my doing so wasnt too prohibitive. Friends and acquaitances again be made amongst those with similiar goals..engaged in similiarly POSITIVE activities. I graduated HS in 74,  and went to college and grad school in the late ’70’s, a time where the drug culture was such it swarmed all about me.  I was too busy with studies and work,  to have any involvement with people getting high, everywhere…I looked.. Their mommy and daddy’s were footing the bill for their college expenses, they could afford such,  I couldnt. ..besides I preferred to take the bus over to the Gym,  and swim laps and spend some time in the sauna…in my free time, that was my high,  rather than whatever everyone round me was getting high on. Shortly before I turned 18, the drinking age was lowered to 18, owing to cries 18 yearolds were sent to war, ought to be able to have a drink. So by sophomore year..they installed a compus PUB! I go, but was so antsy while there, I have a glass of wine..with friends..and be on my way…even when it be Rick Springstein or Renaissance playing…I was too busy.the Pub was always so smoky..and everyone in it was so  DRUNK and or HIGH! During my professional years, between memberships in Y’s and ski clubs,and scuba clubs..swimming, sking..and scubadiving were my past times.. so once again my involvements were with people doing those things.. and only occaisionally would coworkers get me to join them for a drink after work…But like in college…I get antsy in a bar…have a drink with them and be on my way. I never known a drunk or a drug addict  while they were a drunk or a drug addict.  In recent years, though I been found appealing by ex drunks and drug addicts.. Why…all the sudden do I find myself being sought out by such people..trying to involve me in relationships with them.. And, I think it has something to do with  my antidepressant use..and all it really did to me…insidiously…without me knowing…or understanding,  or recognizing it…something supposed to have helped me…in reality turned me into a damn junkie. I took the first SSRI, prozac  and all the others  to ENABLE me to cope better with difficult circumstances and help me manage my life. Unfortunately, it did the opposite… while inciting thoughts along the lines…of don’t worry, be happy,  don’t give all you worked for the previous 20 years,  educationally and professionally any thought at all, becoming the  world series of poker champion is the a much more worthy calling, anyway  and you are your own boss, can make your own hours…call the shots…much more conducing to single parenting! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL So what if you losing contact with good friends..cause they dont know you any more,  and your relationships among people are becoming increasingly amongst those you never have a thing to do with before you were prozaced, or zolofted, or paxilated, or wellbetroned, or serzoned.. to their being drunk, or high on their  crystal meth, or their cocaine or their poison of choice.. So what if all your previous motivation to do positive, and worthy things in the crapper on Paxil…and you are going down the tubes…on the way to the dump heap…trash bin…the gutter… Just take that Paxil..and you wont feel the pain…on your way down, down, down… At least until you hit your bottom…and go SPLAT! And think,  what the heck….  how did this happen.. and come to a NG…where everyone is in friggen denial bout what prozac, paxil, zoloft, and WB, and serzone really doing to them…making them junkies… NO SSRI anonymous  for paxil junkies… no place to turn to when noone admits you been medicating into junkiehood… That when you stop paxil  the next 18 months…is in reality…recovery from a drug addiction with all up and downs and mood swings…involved in learning to deal with your feelings again after 10 years of having them blunted by meds..  etc etc.. All and totally and completely ALONE  with the knowledge..you are attempting to recover from being a SSRI junkie, addict…user… Cause it being addictive…and causing drug dependence and making a junkie of you…is DEnied, denied denied…. while your mental lonliness.. is so unimaginable  in a world chooses to deny and ignore the reality that those 85 million prescriptions for SSRIS  are prescriptions for junkiedom for those 85 million people. It’s truly a lonely road them want to get off SSRI’s are on…all by themselves…with the knowledge they are junkies having to kick an addiction not recognized as an addiction. .

Response:

> while your mental lonliness.. is so unimaginable  in a world chooses to deny > and ignore the reality that those 85 million prescriptions for SSRIS  are > prescriptions for junkiedom for those 85 million people. > It’s truly a lonely road them want to get off SSRI’s are on…all by > themselves…with the knowledge they are junkies having to kick an addiction > not recognized as an addiction.

Thank you for the trip down memory lane, it was enjoyable. So, you come to a depression support group, which has a major emphasis on medications, and tell people the very medications that have helped them return to normal, partial recovery, or have even saved their lives in cases that they are junkies? As the saying goes, with friends like you…

Response:

> Though suffering some degree of depression,  most of my life I managed to > develop friendships were generally positive, supportive and beneficial.

Whether or not your theory is correct is unimportant, IMHO. What steps are you taking, what decisions are you making, what choices do you recognize, to leave this all behind?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> while your mental lonliness.. is so unimaginable  in a world chooses to deny > and ignore the reality that those 85 million prescriptions for SSRIS are > prescriptions for junkiedom for those 85 million people. > It’s truly a lonely road them want to get off SSRI’s are on…all by > themselves…with the knowledge they are junkies having to kick an addiction > not recognized as an addiction. > Thank you for the trip down memory lane, it was enjoyable. > So, you come to a depression support group, which has a major emphasis > on medications, and tell people the very medications that have helped > them return to normal, partial recovery, or have even saved their lives > in cases that they are junkies? > As the saying goes, with friends like you…

Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you present.. IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with news and research results in these areas.. Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal ..be that a positive or negative experience. just my 2c regards, Bob

Response:

> Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you present.. > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with news > and research results in these areas.. > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal ..be > that a positive or negative experience. > just my 2c > regards, > Bob

Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > and research results in these areas.. > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > that a positive or negative experience. > just my 2c > regards, > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched.

Bob, Junkies? That only serves to inflame. As for news and discussion, I think we can have that without SSRI users being referred to as junkies. Her _only_ intent was to inflame, but defend her if you must. Individual experiences true, but not the highly inflammatory 85 million junkies. — I hate to say it but I personally believe some of the ideas for prescribing neuroleptics for aggression in non-psychotic cases stems from the huge influx of jews in psychiatry.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > and research results in these areas.. > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > that a positive or negative experience. > just my 2c > regards, > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched.

At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order regardless of diagnosis. In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as manic can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and become more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely shells.. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > > and research results in these areas.. > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because of > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > > that a positive or negative experience. > > just my 2c > > regards, > > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > Bob, Junkies? That only serves to inflame.

I suppose it does if you extract and highlight the word from a long and thoughtful piece about the lonely plight of people suffering from "discontinuation syndrome". there is no longer much doubt that many people have been needlessly put into a state of harmful drug dependency and its only fairly recently that their situation has been acknowledged.. > As for news and discussion, I think we can have that without SSRI users > being referred to as junkies.

In an ideal world perhaps :>) had you had the experience and suffered the damage (BTW that you persist in mockingly dismissing as drunkeness) you too might be quite bitter about it..She speaks as an insider and a longtime SSRI user. Her _only_ intent was to inflame, IMO your personal antipathy and eagerness to align yourself with her enemies sways your judgement. you are mindreading as Ralph calls it.  but > defend her if you must.

Im suprised you havent noticed that I *havent* been doing such.. Its a rather important principle Im defending here.. That a truth shouldnt be stifled because the loudest voices find it unpalateable > Individual experiences true, but not the highly inflammatory 85 million > junkies.

I think you will find that the statement was that the 85 million prescriptions were potential roads to junkiedom. Its a bit disingenuous to suggest that a victims wish to prevent future victims.. is in some fashion insulting the victims.. If you came off your Jihad long enough to actually listen and understand..rather than scan text for juicy ammunition in your flamewar you might be a bit more compassionate.. "Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster.And when you look in the abyss, the abyss also looks into you." Friedrich Nietzche – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> — > I hate to say it but I personally believe some of the ideas for > prescribing neuroleptics for aggression in non-psychotic cases stems > from the huge influx of jews in psychiatry.

Response:

I think it is a degre to the suffering, when C’ella (Cruella?) is her sickest (imho) she goes on these rampages. Wasn’t Lynda on her kill file?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > present.. > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > news > > and research results in these areas.. > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence because > of > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > ..be > > that a positive or negative experience. > > just my 2c > > regards, > > Bob > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who > trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order > regardless of diagnosis. > In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as manic > can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and become > more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who > just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely > shells..

Response:

> I think it is a degre to the suffering, when C’ella (Cruella?) is her > sickest (imho) she goes on these rampages. Wasn’t Lynda on her kill file?

Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. Ill happily discuss the issues. You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in isolation. smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and personal attacks.. Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal redress is no substitute for support. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > > present.. > > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete with > > news > > > and research results in these areas.. > > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence > because > of > > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are universal > > ..be > > > that a positive or negative experience. > > > just my 2c > > > regards, > > > Bob > > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who > trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order > regardless of diagnosis. > In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as manic > can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and > become > more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who > just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely > shells..

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. >Ill happily discuss the issues. >You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more >interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in >isolation. >smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and >personal attacks.. >Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal >redress is no substitute for support. > Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog as > he does.

I think he just supports Linda C right or wrong.. Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it.

I know.. It gets so that us discussing or arguing about meds and their effects seems like a sideshow… or interuption to the personal abuse.. and there is no shame in saying if you are depressed you just cant cope with it.. there was a lot of good stuff you posted that I wanted to respond to from my POV  but you have to kind of pluck it out from the garbage personal abuse.. BTW what was the result with the new meds and that ? regards, Bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I think it is a degre to the suffering, when C’ella (Cruella?) is her > sickest (imho) she goes on these rampages. Wasn’t Lynda on her kill file? > Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. > Ill happily discuss the issues. > You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more > interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in > isolation. > smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and > personal attacks.. > Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal > redress is no substitute for support. > > > > Ironically this is EXACTLY Erics position and motivation that you > > > present.. > > > > IMO both percieved benefits and adversive side effects and > > > > potential dangers should be able to be freely discussed..complete > with > > > news > > > > and research results in these areas.. > > > > Discussion should not be stifled or people bullied into silence > because > > of > > > > mistaken views that individual experiences of medication are > universal > > > ..be > > > > that a positive or negative experience. > > > > just my 2c > > > > regards, > > > > Bob > > > Yes much like those bipolar trollers should not be squelched. > > At the risk of being called a santimonious hypocrite I think anyone who > > trolls a support group to personally abuse posters is out of order > > regardless of diagnosis. > > In terms of the difference.. it seems to me that people diagnosed as > manic > > can often cope better with flame wars and abuse..and even thrive and > become > > more invigorated with the conflict than can the severely depressed.. who > > just become more depressed and give up and sink back into their lonely > > shells..

Response:

Don’t read em Eric, btw if you haven’t noticed I left the slice alone until _she_ attacked my friend. You do understand the concept of friendship don’t you Eric? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. >Ill happily discuss the issues. >You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are more >interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" in >isolation. >smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and >personal attacks.. >Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal >redress is no substitute for support. > Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog as > he does. Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it. > Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

Response:

> >BTW what was the result with the new meds and that ? > New med?

you were concerned you were going to go psychotic or something and took a break.. you said you were trying something new ? maybe I have got it wrong.. to do with your physical problems? regards, Bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

Response:

That’s such bullshit Bob you fucking love the wars, your right there in the middle of all this pointing fingers naming names, "H" worrd inserted here.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >Im not getting into personalities Robert or joining your flame war.. > >Ill happily discuss the issues. > >You are in no position to call others cruel ..and enquiring minds are > more > >interested in the issues raised by suffering "discontinuation syndrome" > in > >isolation. > >smaller  minds are interested in point scoring ..thread derailing and > >personal attacks.. > >Its a serious and tragic plight for many and the newly available legal > >redress is no substitute for support. > Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I > dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog > as > he does. > I think he just supports Linda C right or wrong.. > Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda > Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it. > I know.. > It gets so that us discussing or arguing about meds and their effects seems > like a sideshow… or interuption to the personal abuse.. > and there is no shame in saying if you are depressed you just cant cope with > it.. > there was a lot of good stuff you posted that I wanted to respond to from my > POV  but you have to kind of pluck it out from the garbage personal abuse.. > BTW what was the result with the new meds and that ? > regards, > Bob > Eric > Always take your drugs…LostBoyinNC > Steroids caused my depression…prednisone should be used conservatively

Response:

Don’t worry about it, Robert. Bob conveniently overlooks that this thread was started as nothing more than an attack, out of the blue, by one of his protected flock. > You are in no position to call others cruel

Well, I am, Bob. And she is. I won’t bore you with quotes, because you’ll ignore them anyway.

Response:

Oh well ..back to the alice in wonderland logic where stating clearly that I will discuss the issues  but not the personalities proves Im flaming.. sigh.. > Don’t worry about it, Robert. Bob conveniently overlooks that this thread > was started as nothing more than an attack, out of the blue, by one of his > protected flock.

The title of the thread states fairly succintly what the piece is about.. and it actually summarises the experience of many sufferers particularly but not only.. long term Paxil users . An ABC medical journalist recently said pretty much the same.. In an email group Im in ..no less than four separate people tonight talked of how they and their relatives concerns were dismissed as imaginary or symptomatic of the ilness treated rather than the effect of the Paxil withdrawal that it later turned out to be.. Ill say the same to you as I said to Robert ..Im quite happy to discuss the issues which are important ones for many ..but Im not getting involved with your personality clashes.. Its ultimately pretty boring .. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > You are in no position to call others cruel > Well, I am, Bob. And she is. I won’t bore you with quotes, because you’ll > ignore them anyway.

Response:

> Id like to know why Robert comes here specifically to harass Linda Gore. I dont > know what Linda ever did to Robert to make him harass her like a rabid dog as > he does. Its ridiculous. I get sick and tired of reading these cheesy back and > forth flame wars between Robert, Linda "Briteyes" and others and Linda Gore. > Its old…Im sick of it.

Maybe if she’d stop bashing his illness, yet rambling wild off topic herself. Just a thought. If so many people are flaming Linda, did you ever think it might be her? — I think to myself, "you stupid fuck nigger, you are in the USA and not Ghana or West Afrika. Why dont you wear the requisite clothing?

Response:

>had you had the experience and suffered the damage (BTW that you persist in >mockingly dismissing as drunkeness) you too might be quite bitter about >it..She speaks as an insider and a longtime SSRI user. > Bob, I was offended. > If she wants to debate me on the merits, fine.

well I wish you or someone would instead of simply following mojos call to a personal flame war..  Calling everyone an > addict,

She didnt call everyone an addict at all thats a travesty of what she said..deliberately invoked to continue a pattern of personal attacks then poking fun at the meds that Fiona took for bipolar > crosses the line, period.

Fiona has said equally off-colour things to her.. things to her.. and no-one said a word about it .. as I read it it was a tongue in cheek reference to the meds inciting the grandiosity she was accused of.. Quickly and skilfully picked up on by "Mojo" whose only purpose here is to attack Linda and Eric.. > I have been an addict, and to compare that to SSRI usage is a joke, no > ifs, ands, or buts.

Well I have too and ..of itself ..heroin addiction does arguably much less harm..and to massively fewer numbers.. I realise addiction conjures up pictures of people scouring alleys to mug old ladies and people rolling about smoking crack cocaine but actually far more doctors and nurses are addicts than you might imagine and outwardly live quite respectable and unremarkable lives.. People in vast numbers are being given drugs that are quite innapropriate and find they are unable to come off them . Discontinuation syndrome is a more neutral term but many like the Paxil lawer feel its simply a word game.. If you cant function as a human being without a supply of a drug what would you call it? And this fate because you went to a GP complaining of shyness for example!! and he/she didnt inform of this because they didnt know themselves because all thr information comes from the drug company.. thats what makes people like me angry.. IMO thats the issue not petty bickering and personality clashes.. or who can be in whose gang.. regards, Bob > Sharon > He who fears he shall suffer, already suffers what he fears. – Michel de

Montaigne

Response:

> x-no-archive:yes

And forgeting to mention and I’m sure you’ll bring it up. Well I didnt :>) > Yes, I will challenge her mental status when she does that to me, or > BP’s in General. I will challenge her on her meds, when she does that. > If it’s good enough for her, surely you’ll support me.

Whats sauce for the goose is certainly sauce for the gander and  its another smear and travesty the suggestion that I support Linda in whatever she says ..put about by the very people who asked me to befriend her as a matter of fact.. If you look at what i have *actually* said as opposed to what certain people have implied I have said… you will notice I havent actually got involved at all.. Linda not only is quite capable of speaking for herself but actively dislikes her friends sticking up for her.. Maybe its because Im an aquarian but I tend to support ideas and principles more than the people making them as far as arguments go.. I know Bush has made it all the rage in America but Im not very keen on this "if your not with me your against me" business.. a long response again and possibly all I have to say on the matter.. Now I must sleep but I thought you deserved a considered answer as you seemed quite genuine .. regards, Bob > Sharon > He who fears he shall suffer, already suffers what he fears. – Michel de

Montaigne

Response: